Title: Talk about the Michael Sussmann case
Show: Garland Nixon
Date: 2021-09-24
URL: https://youtu.be/z_xfYPpMpDA
Duration: 38:00

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[00:01] hi my name is garland nixon and i'm a political analyst and i'm john kiriakou a former cia officer and we've got some interesting stuff to talk to you about tonight um very very a tangled web that we got to talk about i don't think one show would cover this i don't know if 10 shows would cover it but he'll the uh the clinton campaign um has been directly implicated in a plot to um deliberately paint donald trump as a uh russian bot so so we'll talk about it

[00:32] we'll give you a few couple a minute to go on we'll be right back [Music]

[01:04] well john i don't really know where to start on this so here's what i'm going to do i will read the final a paragraph of the indictment which is count one in the only count and we'll go from there on or about september 19 2016 within the district of columbia michael a sousman the defendant did willfully and knowingly make a materially false fictitious and fraudulent statement or representation in a matter before the jurisdiction of the executive branch of the government of the united states to wit

[01:35] on or about september 19 2016 the defendant stated to the general counsel of the fbi that he was not acting on behalf of any client in conveying particular allegations concerning a presidential candidate when in truth and in fact and as the defendant well knew knew he was acting on behalf of specific clients namely tech executive one and the clinton campaign like i said this would take a lot of shows to cover this but let's start john i'm just gonna throw throw this out on

[02:05] the floor for the good of the order and you started what are your thoughts here you know a couple of things struck me uh about this indictment first of all it's 27 pages long and a typical indictment uh for one count of what is known as a process felony or a throwaway felony like this one making a false statement is usually a page long at the most usually it's a couple of paragraphs you have sort of the preamble and then the actual um indicting information this went on for 27 pages and it's

[02:38] because they wanted to get all of the details out there now with that said the indictment is less important than the narrative the narrative is that the clinton campaign corruptly went to the justice department to accuse the trump campaign of having either been infiltrated by the russians or working in some capacity on behalf of the russians uh we know that that's not true we know

[03:09] now definitively that that's not true but it it was like the only way to really get the information out there was to indict somebody and sussman was the logical person to indict now with all that said this charge is very weak and the reason why it's weak is that in this meeting with a very senior justice department official it was just the two of them right it was just the doj official

[03:39] and uh the attorney sussman um the doj official did not take notes what he did was after the meeting he dictated his recollections from the meeting to a deputy and the deputy took the notes now the sussman legal team is going to argue that these notes were not contemporaneous that perhaps he misheard what it was that sussman

[04:10] wanted to convey blah blah blah blah sussman may very well get out of it but again that's not the point the point is that that special uh investigator durham uh or special prosecutor i i think we're not supposed to use the term special prosecutor anymore special investigator durham is getting his side of the story out there so even if this indictment is

[04:41] thrown out or if it goes to trial and sussman's acquitted it doesn't matter because now we know exactly how the clinton campaign got to doj to spread these lies about the russians you know the the the thing that stuck in my mind immediately were were the connections and that is that at the same time and i'll tell you where i'm going with this it's hard for me to not to look at this and think that the fbi is corrupt and involved in it from top to bottom and

[05:12] there's so many areas but start here i don't think it's plausible for the fbi to argue that they didn't know sussman was working on behalf of the clinton campaign simply because they were working with the with fusion gps the fbi was working with fusion gps who was and fusion gps was working for the clinton campaign and let me add one more thing the fbi the doj i don't know if it was exactly the fbi or somebody up in the doj but at

[05:43] any rate wrote up it was the fbi they wrote up a fisa uh one they took it to the fisa court and in that warrant they did the exact same thing that they're accusing michael sussman of they hid from the fisa court and we know because that's in the ig horowitz report they the the fbi hid from the fisa judges that christopher steele's uh information was paid for by the clinton campaign so they did exactly yes what they're

[06:15] saying they're going after sussman for and both grew in susman was working with fusion gps i just feel like it was one big criminal operation and one part of the big opportunity to let susan go they gotta let him walk this guy they can't nobody can go down because one person could bring everybody down no you're exactly right i'm so glad that you said what you said because i was gonna i was gonna raise this same thing the fbi and the just and the justice department knew that the steele dossier had begun as opposition research and that the source

[06:46] of the steele dossier was the clinton campaign now you remember in the very beginning that the clinton campaign um put out this rumor that it actually originated with with a republican campaign and they hinted that it was ted cruz that was nonsense there was a relationship between christopher steele and the clinton people and that resulted in the steele dossier the clinton people knew that the dossier was made up right they knew that it was just unvetted raw intelligence the purpose of which was to make donald

[07:18] trump look as bad as they possibly could and they presented it to the justice department as fact as finished intelligence and it wasn't it never was yeah and the other thing is um look i mean there's just so many facets of this but when you look at at there's tech executive one i don't know who it is but you know no idea as an old investigator here as an old investigator let me tell you where i'd start snooping around so this investigator this person

[07:49] apparently has the ability to do cyber investigations don't they they were searching dnf look at the things that they were doing right whoever this person is this person can do cyber investigations so we know whoever tech executive is one is they're probably pretty good with cyber investigations all right we do also know if we research carefully we find out that michael sussman was the guy who hired crowdstrike

[08:20] for the dnc correct right owned by dimitri alparovich and sean what's his name a former fbi agent right and oh wait a minute what's crowdstrike do cyber investigation as an old investigation i have no idea who it is but i would go to crowdstrike and start questioning people there yeah perhaps they'd know someone who could do cyber

[08:51] investigations who was closely connected to the clinton campaign and who maybe perhaps was connected directly to michael sussman that's where i'd start snooping around as an old investigator but what do i know i'm retiring i i think you've cracked the case and you know one of our one of our viewers melinda ann burns makes a very good point that i'd like to repeat here she says these people are always going after the low-hanging fruit no bigwigs ever get charged convicted or punished and she is exactly right do you have any

[09:23] idea what the sentencing guideline is for this crime now this is a felony let's make a wild assumption that michael sussman is going to be convicted the sentencing guideline for a first time conviction on this low-hanging felony is zero to six months in prison with six months being if you have a prior criminal record so even if they if they convict this guy which they won't he's not going anywhere near a prison is

[09:56] this really worth the taxpayers money this investigation has been going on for four and a half years now if if your intent is to expose the clinton campaign then by god congratulations you've you've accomplished your mission and the country is better for it but don't make it look like this is you know you're tracking down the big wig criminals you're not well you know what i think is going on here and you know i guess i'm going down conspiracy

[10:27] theory lane but if you look at the evidence i'm not what i think where where they're jammed up is this i mean the fbi was part of the operation clearly let me add this okay so we have fusion gps and perkins coi so fusion gps produces the steele dossier perkins chord produces this alpha bank scandal both of them scandal but if you read the steele dossier there's one little section in there

[10:57] that says alpha bank and then it says putin's buddy is an alpha bank and that guy handles like a hundred thousand dollars cash and hands it out to people for putin he's putin's bag man putin's money man right but there's nothing else in there about that and you look at that and you're saying well what the hell is that doing in the steele dossier is there something connected to it it's nothing it's just and you're like what the hell and now you look at this and you're like okay it doesn't align with anything else in the steele dossier that aligns perfectly

[11:30] with the argument that they were making it perkins coy so they were just running parallel tracks here and they were the same and when you look at the emails and the meetings they were the same people working together they probably wrote those documents in the same room together and passed them around each other they probably did and it just goes to show you the the depths to which the the dnc and the 2016 clinton campaign uh would plunge

[12:00] and this is something we ought to we ought to be talking about i mean not just you and me but as a nation we should talk about the dnc as a as a political machine and the rnc for that matter because god knows that the republicans do exactly the same kind of thing this is the problem that we've gotten ourselves into in this country with with a duopoly that we have where the two parties just trade positions back and forth every couple of years this doesn't serve the american people in any way it encourages

[12:31] corruption yep let me let me share here's something this is this is off of the document and this is something that i want to ask you about let's give me a second here i got to share the screen all righty all right john so if we look down here what we find is that um okay section 35 order about october 30th on a unemployed an employee of the u.s investigative firm

[13:02] appears to be fusion gps forwarded another report a reporter a tweet which indicated that the fbi director had explosive information about trump's ties to russia the investigative firm's employee email stated time to hurry suggesting the reporters should hurry to publish an article regarding the russian bank allegations in response reporter 2 emailed to the investigative firm employee a draft article regarding the russia bank allegations along with the cover message here's the first 2500

[13:35] words the the um let me stop sharing here so the clinton campaign was literally just planting stories in the media the media is sending them articles here's the first 2500 words does this work it's that's the other part of the corruption it's not just that they were trying to get hillary clinton elected okay that we know that but they were willing to participate in corruption corruption that could end up

[14:06] dragging us into a nuclear war nuclear war we're talking about corruption where you're creating enmity with a a nuclear power that is every bit as powerful as you are with nuclear weapons either one of them could take us out the the recklessness of that is is just uh unfathomable and this points to another very serious problem and that is collusion between uh between members of the media and uh and the federal government we know thanks to to the intrepid jason

[14:38] leopold at buzzfeed uh the king of the freedom of information act request we know we know thanks to him that msnbc's ken delanian or nbc news is ken delanian their chief national security correspondent um was sending his articles to the cia before he was sending them to his own editor this is what they do you know rather than than to develop your own sources

[15:09] a la woodward and bernstein back in the day uh they just rely on whatever the ucia the fbi and the white house tell them you know it's like taking a a press release and just gisting it and putting it into your own words and then calling it news it's not news well this is yet another example of that and they have the nerve to show i mean clint watts sure you know who that is clint watts literally went before congress and argued that a facebook

[15:39] group that had pictures of puppies was russian election interference because what they were planning on doing see well you don't understand how devious the russians are john that's your problem you're too naive and gullible they were going to take these pictures of puppies and then once people got hooked on the puppies they were going to little by little start putting um uh uh political messages etc i guess maybe the puppies would all get together and spell borscht or something who knows right i mean and make you love russia exactly

[16:11] subliminally the preposterous things they put together and argue that's election interference dude this is election interference at the highest level they literally to me the here's what i think the federal election commission should go after them because clearly that was done as part of their election campaign and how do we know that because it was paid for out of the funds of the election

[16:41] coffers so the fact of the matter is this what are you doing you in the course of your think about that that money came directly out of the election coffers what can you buy if you were to purchase drugs heroin with money that people had donated to you you could go to jail for that if you were to use that money to violate the law i would argue the fec should be investigating did they use um campaign money to do something that was criminal

[17:12] and well we got what at least part of it was criminal but i'm sure they could dig and find other parts of it that i could i bet you that your thoughts oh i think you're exactly right and this goes back to uh to that comment that we read a few minutes ago they go after the low-hanging fruit not not the big players um there's literally no reason why the fec should not be going after the clinton campaign and going after the clinton campaign's you know campaign chairman the campaign manager maybe hillary

[17:42] clinton herself if if she had something to do with the with the planning of this thing why isn't there an fec investigation why isn't there a congressional investigation why aren't the oversight committees involved that's a huge point i didn't even think about that right now congress should be saying we're concerned with election interference we can't exactly write so we got to look because that was clearly they utilized use the media i mean the problem is this i think when i look at this this thing

[18:14] was written up like how can we just make sure we have a name attached to this we're not going to be able to do this without a name and there was too much dirt for whatever reason durham wanted to get this story out i don't know how much i trust him or anybody else but i'm glad a lot of this information got out this is the same john durham who refused to charge any of the torturers involved in the cia's torture campaign right this is the guy that refused to charge the

[18:46] likes of john brennan and jose rodriguez and these and these monsters at the cia who dragged our national reputation through the mud 10 years ago right but but this crime he'll charge that doesn't make any sense to me i look at him like bar barr has a long history he's an operative i think durham is an operative and i think this is for whatever reason they didn't mind getting this out maybe they just felt like look we're gonna have to take some blood and we're gonna have to lose some blood we'll lose minimum amount of blood we'll go ahead

[19:18] look this is making the 2016 hillary campaign look bad right hillary ain't running no more and it ain't 2016. so as long as they don't charge any of these people but in a blink of an eye it was seven eight years ago right so that all walks this guy he's playing don't forget they filed these charges just two days before the statute of limitations expired yep two days i mean here's the thing he gets next to nothing anyway and to me it's part of an operation here's see they can't go after

[19:49] anybody they have to have somebody agree to say i'll be the one because they were working with the fbi and everybody knew it it was part of an fbi operation think about this when you when it goes to this how close can we get to sussman and uh assessment in the fbi so susman was working with perkins coy and fusion gps if you look at it they were like meeting they were emailing back and forth they were working together on an operation fusion gps they were being paid by the same clients this

[20:21] was an operation that they were being paid together to work together okay so those two are working together meanwhile the cia claims to us that they dropped christopher steele but one of the doj lawyers a guy named bruce orr his wife was working for fusion gps so you mean to tell me the doj had one of their people's wives working for for for using gps and fusion gps was working directly with sussman every day and she didn't know the sussman was working for the clinton

[20:52] campaign she was working with him and the clinton campaign her husband's a doj lawyer he didn't somehow figure it out either the fbi the evidence they were they were drowning in evidence but they didn't see it john you know if it wasn't so serious it would be hilarious and when you lay it all out like you just did in plain english it sounds so ridiculous that it can't be true right

[21:22] but all of it is true all of it's true where we're supposed to believe that the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing that when husbands and wives you know go home at the end of the work day they don't have any idea what each other was doing during the course of the day they don't even know where their spouses work right one of the fbi is looking at the clinton campaign the other one's working for a contractor for the clinton campaign uh they're the the campaign people are

[21:54] talking to the fbi the fbi people are talking to the campaign and they just pretend that everything is all fine and good and normal and legal which is what the real problem is and we only find out about this now years after the fact that's unacceptable and during the same investigation let's not forget so during this investigation look at some of the things that happened susman supposedly hid that he was working for the clinton camp campaign right the fbi hid that steele was working for

[22:25] the clinton campaign so the fbi and cis-men are all working together they also tried to hide that they were still working with steele that was a hot they were hiding that that's why it went from okay you talked to an fyei agent into to okay you talked to the wife of a doj lawyer who passes it on to her who now so all they did was put a middle person in in in between steel yes there that's all they did it was obvious and deliberate deliberate what they were doing and look who's been fired mccabe

[22:56] was fired for lying um but not prosecuted right uh uh comey was run out the door for lion i mean not prosecuted so right those two guys were run out from line but not prosecuted regarding the uh the the trump russian investigation kevin kleinsmith was prosecuted for deliberately lying and might i had mccabe and uh comey should have both been um uh prosecuted for deliberately lying they were perjury they deliberately

[23:26] signed off on documents knowingly and lied to the fisa court on several occasions every one of those is a separate charge and that's and each one of those is a felony that carries with it up to five years in a federal prison so why weren't they charged why weren't they prosecuted you know too big to prosecute come on we're not supposed to have people like that in the united states yep so so if you look at the the the trump russia investigation a lot of the people that were heavily involved peter strzok run out the door

[23:58] for lying and cheating stealing everything you name it right a lot a lot of the people that have involved have been caught in wrongdoing directly related to that here's what i hope happens but i don't trust our courts enough anyway i hope trump sees every one of them i don't i think you know some of those in particular groups are are well i don't know because a lot of times like the uh um government agencies or personnel will be immune from immune from um from being sued right yeah but

[24:28] then at the same time at the same time if you sue the campaign you sue the clinton campaign right then you're entitled to discovery and then that all of this comes out into the public well that's what i was thinking he couldn't necessarily probably see the people but he could write zeus men he could sue the people at gps he could do all of them and in discovery you know so everybody that he can touch that he sues and i hope he does because discovery now really what you'll find they can't do it you know if this will be a rare instance where they'll do a

[24:58] pull of hillary clinton i mean let's face it she just saw it destroyed 33 000 emails and her only option was to go to jail if she didn't and sometimes people have an option you ask for discovery and it's like well let's see if i give you the murder weapon right i'm going to jail i'll throw that in the river yeah i never saw it that's right that's right that's washington that's how things work here it's been like this uh you know since the beginning really the important people get away with it they get away with everything yeah you know let me ask you this uh uh

[25:31] uh um because you know as i said i don't have any idea who tech executive one is i have no idea who he is who he was but let's just say that if it's as i said susan has has connections to um to direct connections to uh a crowd strike so we don't know if i have no i'm not going to imply in any way i think it's them but i'm just saying that

[26:01] another thing that i think would be a point of evidence i don't know what it says but i think this would be a point of evidence and that is the um uh uh uh um if i if if they knew who he was if he was in any way connected to uh to to to that to to um if the and of course they know who he was but if the if by any way shape or form the tech executive one had some connection to them right

[32:41] an obviously a criminal or internationally criminal espionage case whatever you know that they would accept a private company that they would accept their word of what they found on the server and never get it first of all that they'd accept their word okay but for this reason how do you know how if you're the fbi if it's me and i go there and i'm like hey who'd you get we got crowd strike hey we think we're hit by the russians or whoever right i'm here's the first thing i have to think i don't know the crowd

[33:12] strike is not inside people on the bad guys i don't know that crowdstrike didn't come in and they're the ones that opened the door and let them in i don't have to i'm not can't trust crowdstrike hey i guess you're the good guy hell no that's not the way it works when you're doing investigation so i'm not gonna bring the fox in to investigate the in-house murders i'm gonna say crowdstrike oh they got hit i'm not eliminating them as a suspect i'm not eliminating anybody as a suspect as i said when i start looking at that servers i want to talk to crowdstrike

[33:43] and interview them and say i want to know what you did to these servers you've you've already examined them before we got here i want to know what you did i want to see what you did i want to see everything the results of everything or your ass has gone to jail because this is a national security issue right now so don't hold your breath so the idea that the fbi would just trust a private company to use their and add this because the data that you're using here

[34:14] could be eventually be used to prosecute somebody but it couldn't because you don't have any data because all you've got is a a a witness so if like some russian guy from dc knocked on their off door and said guys it's me i'm uh you know a spy from whatever country i did it i'm guilty yeah they couldn't prosecute them with that evidence because they have none they have none and i've got to ask too and this is not a rhetorical question but why in the world would a senior doj

[34:46] official meet with somebody with anybody let alone with a senior partner from perkins coy and not have a note taker not have a witness or even not have it recorded right i mean that's what the fbi does that's what they're supposed to do all the time but here's the number three or number four in the justice department and he's just winging it has a guy over to his office they chew the fat for a little bit the guy essentially

[35:17] confesses to a crime in the course of the conversation and they're not going to take notes they're going to dictate the notes a little bit later just to the best of their recollection and then charge a felony out of it this is like amateur hour over there at the justice department it is but when it it it is if you believe their narrative right you know what i mean right perhaps there there is something for them to gain by making themselves look stupid in this case well what's the alternative you know what i mean yeah

[35:47] the alternative is you can't charge anybody right and the alternative is that you find out who was involved in this with the clinton people and i i mean when i look at comey i look at his history i look at his fealty to hillary i just got to say this guy was working with the clinton campaign i just believed that the entire time um i don't trust him i don't trust any of them and um mccabe all of them and here's the here's another tell that that the machine was hiding for itself robert mueller or it wasn't really

[36:19] mueller it was the other guy really that did an investigation they just stamped mueller's name on it yeah but was it 20 or 40 000 text messages between peter strzok and his girlfriend and the investigation's going on mueller finds them and i've never heard of this before so in the midst of the evidence of the investigation mueller has a critical piece of evidence which is the text messages between two um fbi employees who are at the heart of the investigation so man that's critical evidence

[36:51] and he erases it all and he erases it erases it yeah destruction of evidence is a felony yes yeah and have you read anyone but one in the media hey why'd you do that yeah no nobody cares nobody cares no in any other in the other country this would be an explosive front page story it would shake confidence in government in any other country and here people are like eh you

[37:22] know business as usual that's a swamp in a way what you're saying is true and indicative of a collapsing i'm going to just be straight out a collapsing empire and what i mean is this the people of the empire have lost faith in the institutions that hold the empire together that make this culture right people have lost faith so when they hear corruption it's like hey boy that was short corrupt and

[37:52] people are like and you expected something else out of washington d.c really right i'm going i got to go play pickleball they're gone they'd rather go play pickleball what do they care because they know that what do you go what's going to happen tomorrow well we're going to leave one of the countries that we invaded and we're going to find out that we laundered um two and a half trillion dollars into the hands of the the war profiteers that'll happen next week and then the week after some other corruption will come out yes yes welcome to washington yeah well thanks a lot john we're at

[38:24] well a long room this is 40 minutes but uh you know we had plenty we had a lot to talk about we didn't touch nearly on some of the other stuff but we'll keep all this i'm sure some other things will pop up i'm rendering just wondering you and i are wondering who could tech executive one be hmm somebody is gonna leak it it's washington yeah they are and man that's a that is a huge one got to tell you that all right thanks a lot thanks a lot everybody coop dub thanks everybody michael melinda and burns she's always out there peace john and i are out
