Title: Trump's Iran Gamble w/ George Galloway
Show: The Deep Focus Show
Date: 2026-02-19
URL: https://youtu.be/EYUmojqVGwI
Duration: 62:00

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[00:03] Uh this is a world historic moment. It either could be the resolution of the Israeldriven hostility of the United States [music] to the Islamic Republic of Iran, or it could be the precursor of a war throughout [music] the world. Hi, I'm John Kuryaku and welcome back to another episode of Deep Focus. We're recording this on Thursday, February

[00:34] 12th. And the reason why I give you the date is that this is a very important day in Washington. Benjamin Netanyahu is in town, obviously, to lobby President Donald Trump to to bomb Iran and to do Israel's dirty work for it. But also this morning, the president announced that he was giving very serious consideration to moving a second aircraft carrier battle group to the Persian Gulf. Right now, the USS George HW Bush is off the coast of Norfick,

[01:05] Virginia. It is supposed to remain in the Atlantic Ocean for the next couple of months doing maneuvers and exercises. Instead, it looks like it's going to be steaming east through the Mediterranean, through the Suez Canal, around the Arabian Peninsula, and right up to Iran's borders. This is a very troubling troubling development because the United States can't make war against Iran. One aircraft carrier battle group,

[01:35] the USS Abraham Lincoln, and its 11 accompanying ships are in the Arabian Sea right now. But it can make war against Iran with two aircraft carrier battle groups. We're going to talk about this with one of the most important, one of the most insightful political analysts anywhere in the world. I am very proud today to tell you that George Galloway is joining us. Mr. Galloway is a British politician. He's a broadcaster and a writer. He has been the leader of

[02:06] the Workers Party of Britain since he founded that party in 2019. He's a former leader of the Respect Party until 2003. He was a member of the British Labor Party from 1997 to 2010. From 2012 to 15 and again in 2024, he was a member of Parliament for five different constituencies. Mr. Galloway does not join us from the UK. He's joining us from Moscow. Why?

[02:37] Because he was harassed and detained at Gatwick airport for more than 5 hours recently, just like our friend, Ambassador Craig Murray, constantly harassed as he enters and leaves his own country. So, George Galloway, thank you so much for joining us. >> The honor is mine, John. Uh, I've followed your work for many years. Thank you. and I'm a great admirer of your soul and I'm very happy to be with you this evening. >> Oh, thank you so much. I feel exactly

[03:07] the same way about you. You have a way of cutting directly to the chase in your analysis and there's so much that I want to ask you about and so much of it is is intertwined with with other issues. You can't talk about Iran without talking about Israel. You can't talk about Israel without talking about Gaza. So, let's start with Iran. I've been in touch o over the last several weeks with um with uh an Omani official and the

[03:37] Omanis are great peaceloving people. They always always act as the intermediary between the United States and Iran. They always offered to host talks between the United States and Iran and have done that more times than I can recall. We hear from both sides that the first round of indirect talks between the United States and Iran that took place in Muscat about a week ago u were were

[04:08] positive. Those talks were positive even if they were indirect. I'm not really sure what positive means. whether it means neither side ran screaming from the room uh or if if that there was some kind of substantive um component to it that they could agree on. I I think just the former is the truth, but give us your thoughts on the current situation between Iran and the United States and how you assess what appears to be the

[04:40] deployment of a second aircraft carrier battle group. Now, >> well, uh, first of all, I share your admiration for the Sultanate of Oman, my favorite Arab country and, uh, the only country which has, uh, a door open, uh, to both sides and, uh, therefore a very strategically important uh, place and uh, we must all pray and hope that uh, their mediation efforts uh, will succeed

[05:10] this time because if they don't, the gates of hell will open and not just in the Persian Gulf but across the world. Uh this is a world historic moment. It either could be the resolution of the Israeldriven hostility of the United States to the Islamic Republic of Iran. Or it could be the precursor of a war throughout the world. Not a world war, but a war throughout the world. because

[05:41] Iran is no pushover as they proved in the 12-day war last year and are ready to prove uh in multiples if the shooting war begins again. So uh of course Donald [snorts] Trump is negotiating. We know his uh style of negotiation is to uh browbeat and bludgeon and maybe even bribe uh the parties to bow to his

[06:12] demands. The Iranians on the other hand are in no need of his money and uh certainly not the kind of people who could be bludgeoned or browbeaten. I think uh something that I should say that isn't widely uh appreciated uh the Iranian leadership are entirely religiously devoted people. Uh therefore death in conflict with the great Satan is uh is a positive thing for them. It's

[06:46] uh a ticket to heaven for them. So you can't really intimidate someone who is ready to fight you to the death and moreover believes that it's a ticket to paradise. I think a lot of western commentators underestimate that point. I mean, we've had uh Trump uh last year and again recently explicitly and implicitly threatening the uh supreme leader of Iran as if such a man can be

[07:17] meaningfully threatened, threatening him with uh with death uh when uh such a death would be a glory to him. So uh it's important that we uh walk a mile in the other fellow's shoes and the other fellow's shoes uh are that this is the 47th year of war. Uh this is not something that happened uh just last year uh or at the uh advent of the uh

[07:49] October 7th post October 7th relations. uh Iran has been at war with the United States and the broader west, its satropes in Europe and indeed in the Persian Gulf itself. Every year of the 47 years now of the Iranian revolution has been a year of confrontation, either kinetic confrontation or terrorist proxy confrontation. and all of the 47 years

[08:22] under economic sanction, quarantine, embargo and siege. So the fact that the Iranian revolution is still standing and is entirely uncorrupted politically speaking, still holding to the principles that founded the revolution, uh gives you some idea of the adversary that Donald Trump has picked, the adversary that he's chosen to fight. >> [snorts] >> Now, if I may segue uh to the point you

[08:54] made uh in your introduction that uh Benjamin Netanyahu is in town, but when is he not in town? This is the seventh time that Netanyahu has visited Washington and Donald Trump's only been in for a year and two weeks. Uh now I mean that's uh a level of intimacy uh that uh would be troubling uh in any circumstances but troubling more because

[09:27] it's self-evident that Netanyahu is not there to see what he can do to help the people of the United States. He's not there to help you with the infrastructural problems that are uh in abundance in your countries. He's not in uh the United States for any positive purpose, but merely to procure more money uh to hold out that begging bowl, but even worse, uh to uh seek the United

[10:00] States to uh agree to risk the lives of its men and women in these uh these battleship groups, these floating coffins that you call aircraft craft carriers uh not one but now two giant floating coffins uh either in the area or sailing towards it. So in part this is the Trump style of negotiation. Uh you could call it the sopranos but it

[10:30] doesn't have the class of the sopranos. Uh it's uh it's a low-level gangsterism uh of the kind that wouldn't look good even in a Hollywood movie. uh it is do what I tell you or I'll kill you. Um and uh I just think that they've chosen the wrong adversary on this occasion. It may be that Donald Trump has spent so much time uh with the uh neighbors of Iran

[11:00] that he thinks they're all cheap uh cheap dates. uh he thinks they'll all fall into his deadly embrace at the uh whiff of Donald Trump perfume, but the Iranians are not like that. And uh if this war begins, uh it will be a long time before it ends and it will not end without very severe losses on the Western Empire side. >> Let me ask you about about Israeli

[11:32] demands. First of all, I want to preface it by saying that the CIA has written not one but two national intelligence estimates, the highest level sense of the intelligence community publication that exists in the US government. Two national intelligence estimates, both concluding that the Iranian government has not and is not seeking a nuclear weapon. Number one, we have the the CIA saying this directly to the president.

[12:02] The Iranians do not have a nuclear weapons program. So now the demand is that the Iranians not enrich any uranium at all and whatever uranium has been enriched has to be turned over to the United States. Now that's changed from a year ago. a year ago it was it had to be turned over to the United Arab Emirates or to the Saudis or who who knows. The second demand is that the [clears throat] Israelis I'm sorry the second demand is

[12:34] that the Iranians forego any missile program at all. I'm I'm hardressed to think of any other country on earth that has had this demand uh placed before it where it is not permitted to defend itself. Now I'm I'm thinking this is because the Israelis were surprised that the Iranians were able to defend themselves during the 12-day war. And indeed, the conventional wisdom is that the Israelis

[13:06] used all of their own defensive missiles and have not yet had the chance to replace them. I'd love to hear your take on this. Are these are these points non-starters? Well, don't forget, John, that Donald Trump already destroyed all of Iran's uh nuclear material in a top gun raid that he uh boasted about endlessly. Uh just in the last uh less than 12 months, uh 7 8 months. Uh so how how then did Iran

[13:39] become again a nuclear threat? Now, you're right to say that the national intelligence findings are that Iran does not have and does not seek uh a nuclear weapons uh option. Uh more fool them. I say the reason you and I are talking now about the imminent perhaps attack on Iran, but never have we discussed any imminent threat to attack North Korea is

[14:10] because North Korea does have a nuclear weapon. The moral of that story is not hard to grasp. I mean, a school boy, school girl could conclude that the only way to stop the United States bullying you or invading and attacking you is to have a nuclear weapon. So, more fool them uh for religious reasons, theological reasons because uh nuclear weapons, weapons of mass destruction are

[14:40] weapons unlimited in space and time. uh the previous leader of Iran Ayat uh declared them unislamic and that's a fatwa to which they hold and uh despite my advice uh they are definitely uh holding to it as your own national intelligence services have testified. So uh that's a a complete red herring. First of all, the nuclear material was

[15:12] destroyed last year, according to the president. Was he lying then or is he lying now? That's a question you'd need to ask him. But in any case, whatever enriched uranium they possess, they are not seeking to turn it into a nuclear weapon. and the IAEA, the referee that's supposed to judge these things, repeatedly uh reported that in the uh the previous um P5+1

[15:43] nuclear uh agreement that President Obama concluded uh with the Iranians. So, it's a big red herring. The second of the demands, as you rightly uh infer with the skepticism in your voice, is a demand that could not possibly be accepted by any country. Uh that uh certainly any country that had enemies. Uh could not agree not to have any missile defenses. uh this is uh a recipe

[16:14] for Iran being entirely at the mercy of uh Benjamin Netanyahu and not many people would agree uh to that proposition. But there is a third proposition uh which is equally unacceptable, a non-starter if ever there was one. The third demand is that Iran has uh to cut all its relations with friendly countries and friendly uh movements. In other words, it's got to

[16:45] tell the brave Yemenes, the only Arab country to stand up for the people in Gaza uh in the last couple of years uh at great cost to themselves. uh the only people in the world who actually acted on the decisions of the International Court of Justice to oppose and interdict uh the commission and the carrying out of genocide by their economic sanctions.

[17:18] That's what they were. They said nobody will be allowed to sail across our waterways with material that could be used in a genocide. Uh so they were the only country in the whole world that did that. Uh so Iran has to cut relations with them, has to cut relations with Iraq. Uh you and I both came in on this point. Uh John, uh I warned Tony Blair and George W. Bush. Uh, the destruction

[17:51] of Arab power in Iraq could only lead to a massive enhancement of Persian power in Iraq. And so it came to pass. They did destroy uh the Arab power that was there. And the Iranians now have uh the closest possible relations with their neighbor in Iraq. And why shouldn't they? Uh so according to the demands of Donald Trump, they should cease to have such relations with their neighbor Iraq.

[18:24] So there's three demands, none of which are negotiable. Uh and if that's the sticking point, well, it's war. But one must ensue that they don't really expect Iran to break relations with its allies. Iran is a massive uh soft power country. Uh it has soft religious and soft national power. Uh right across the Muslim world.

[18:55] I mean there are people in Pakistan right now. There are people in England right now uh that are praying for the for the safety of the Islamic Republic of Iran. They are they they are a global soft power. Um which could turn into hard power uh if a shooting war begins. Of course uh it's unlikely that the Yemenes will allow the United States to pulverize Iran without themselves uh intervening in the war. It's unlikely

[19:27] that the Iraqi militias will do so. It's unlikely that the Hezbollah, their other ally in South Lebanon, will do so. It's unlikely that there are correligionists everywhere in the world will sit on their hands whilst uh United States warplanes and missiles rain down on Iran. So um we must assume that ser voices than are evident in Donald Trump's hourly press briefings uh have

[19:59] told the president this including in the Pentagon because everything that I know and you know the Pentagon knows. Everything that I know and you know the CIA knows. So, um, one must assume that they haven't abrogated their responsibilities and have told the president this. And here's a point you might find controversial. I don't think Donald Trump wants to go to war with Iran. >> Why Netanyahu is in the Oval Office

[20:30] right now? Because he knows that Donald Trump would prefer a negotiated outcome to this. And for a reason, for all the reasons I've given, but for an additional reason, Trump and his family, his grasping in-laws, uh, included, have real material interest in the Arab countries in the Persian Gulf, which will no longer exist as we know them if a war

[21:02] begins. all these countries that empty their gold and and diamonds and pearls and uh gifts of aircrafts and uh golden camels and all the rest. All these countries will will cease to exist as we know them if a war uh begins between the United States and these Arab countries in the Gulf are a effectively a bank for the Trump family business. So that's an additional reason for not creating when

[21:35] there is absolutely no need to a shooting war the consequences of which are incalculable and the end result of which is unfathomable. I think you're 100% correct. And you know, one of the ironies in this whole thing too is when the media speculate about what kind of of settlement we could possibly see were one to be negotiated looks almost identical to the JCPOA that

[22:05] was that was negotiated between the Obama administration and and uh the Iranian government. the the JCPOA was working in terms of of keeping u controls on the Iranian nuclear program. It's exactly the same settlement that was negotiated between the IAEA and the Iraqi government. The same kinds of seals, the same cameras that were that were mounted

[22:36] at the entrances to the to the different nuclear sites. It was exactly the same and it was all verifiable and it was working. And then Donald Trump withdrew from it unilaterally and is trying to force the Iranians to go right back into it. But along with these other Israeli demands of no ballistic missile program, no uh uh uranium enrichment and the cut off of relations with Iran's closest friends in the region. I I also have to

[23:06] agree with you, George, that there's real danger here for Bahrain, for the United Arab Emirates, for Saudi Arab Arabia, especially in the eastern province, which is where most of the oil is. This isn't going to be a country of 92 million people just just rolling over and accepting defeat, you know, without a shot being fired. And and one final point too, I don't know why the Western media are not talking about the fact that Iran has developed hypersonic

[23:36] missiles. The United States doesn't have hypersonic missiles. We're working on one, but we don't have any idea what a hypersonic missile might do to an aircraft carrier, for example. I have an idea. Uh even the uh even the Yemenes have hypersonic missile uh capability. It's extraordinary that the United States does not. Uh but these hypersonic missiles are essentially undefendable. Uh they can only be

[24:07] defended at disproportionate cost at the exhaustion of scarce anti-missile uh uh weaponry and systems. Uh so uh they are as George W. Bush would put it, they are misunderestimating uh the Iranian uh military capability which has of course been greatly enhanced since the 12-day war of last year. First of all, China and Russia have been shipping in like billio uh big

[24:39] transporters with electronic warfare with anti-aircraft capability. Uh Iran is much stronger than it was uh in the 12-day war and Iran did not use its cuttingedge missiles in the 12-day war, but we'll certainly use them in the uh in the next war if war there is. So there are multiple reasons for not beginning this war. Uh I'm so old. I remember the Vietnam War. The Vietnam

[25:11] War cost the United States of America 58,000 of its soldiers uh and airmen. Uh it uh cost the United States uh blood and treasure of unimaginable proportions. And it was begun by people who had no idea how it would end, when it would end, in what circumstances it would end. And we all know it ended with the scramble on the roof of the American

[25:43] embassy in Saigon as was uh with helicopters lifting off with people hanging on to the legs of the chopper. Uh and uh it ended in total ignimonyy and defeat for the United States. And uh I remember cheering it, if you'll forgive me saying so uh with with great heartiness. But uh the uh consequences of a war on Iran are incalculable. I described your two aircraft carriers as

[26:15] floating coffins. They're floating coffins, by the way, without the use of hypersonic missiles. Iran's missile drone uh hypersonic uh capacities are being gravely underestimated and they're all dug very very deep. No one will be able to preemptively destroy them. So every way you dice it, John, it's really better not to do this. >> Yes. Folks, before we go on to our next question, I'd like to pass on a message

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[27:47] to request one by mail. That's johnlovesgold.com or 888 gold053. Um, you know, I want to ask you too about uh lessons learned from the 12-day war because I think that the United States has missed a lot of the lessons that should have been learned during the 12-day war. You'll recall that Israel attacked Iran and the Iranians responded by sending a wave of drones. It was something like 600 drones. The Iranians

[28:19] warned the Israelis in advance that the drones were coming, but they had to save face because they had been attacked. Well, all of those drones were were shot out of the sky, but seven. That's very valuable intelligence that these slowm moving drones that you have 6 hours advanced notice are on their way over still penetrated that vaunted iron dome. And then we see reports that the Israelis used literally all of their

[28:50] surfacetosurface missiles, their surfaceto-air missiles. they have to replenish them. It seems like it would be an incredibly stupid thing to do to launch another war because it's not going to turn out the way the last one did. And when you attack a country of 92 million people, which has very strong allies, especially in Russia and China, that can resupply their missiles, I just don't see the upside for the Israelis

[29:22] and especially for the Americans to want to go to war in the first place. Well, neither can I. But of course, they uh both Israel and the United States frequently act against their own interest. Indeed, the whole MAGA uh platform program idea concept has uh has become MAGA is the last thing it is. It is not America first, it's Israel first. It's not MAGA, it's MIGA. I know these are uh cheap slogans, but they happen to

[29:55] be true. Uh and therefore, you cannot rule out the United States doing something extraordinarily stupid. Now they may imagine, I advise them to unimagine that, but they may imagine that they can uh fire some desultry uh broadside against Iran and then declare victory uh and then retire uh uh

[30:25] telling everyone again like they did before that the top guns have done their job. But I think the Iranian warning should be taken seriously that any attack on Iran will be treated as fullcale war and with the response uh to the best uh and maximum of their capabilities. I don't think the Iranians are bluffing over that. And I don't think the American allies hosting the US military bases in the Arab countries

[30:57] nearby and maybe not so nearby because Iran has missiles that can travel many thousands of kilometers. A lot of American bases, a lot of American interests will be in the direct line of fire. And of course you uh rightly pointed out something which I merely accentuate now uh that the eastern province of Saudi Arabia is where all the oil is but it's also where all the Shiites are. The Shiites being the

[31:29] correligionists of the Islamic Republic of Iran. So, uh, it's bad luck for the Americans that God put Saudi Arabia's oil underneath the land, uh, that is populated by by, uh, correligionists of the, uh, Islamic Republic of Iran. So, you'll have Iraq, you'll have, uh, the eastern province of Saudi Arabia, you'll have Qatar, where the biggest American military base in the world is situated. You'll have the United Arab

[32:00] Emirates, a big fat juicy target which is the subject of particular in Thran. uh they feel particularly betrayed uh by the United Arab Emirates and its closeness to Israel, its constant intrigue with Israel uh and uh and the extent I mean one of the reasons why is the Iranians built Dubai and having built it uh they may very well

[32:33] feel that they have the right to destroy it if uh if the UAE E is as it clearly is in league with the Americans in any uh any new war. So as I say given that all these countries are the source of much laress not just for the United States but for the Trump family personally for Kushner personally. It would be one hell of a risk to uh launch a war against Iran which might lead to

[33:06] the killing of the golden goose that lays so many golden eggs for Trump's own family. Yes, that would be dangerous. I I want to switch if we could or shift I should say uh to uh the issue of of Gaza and the Israeli occupation of of Palestinian lands. We're seeing a resurgence here in the United States of of what what are being euphemistically called real estate seminars. Now, these are

[33:38] being held at uh at synagogues in New Jersey, New York, Toronto, advertising land that's available uh for purchase at very low low prices um in the West Bank and in Gaza. Of course, this is Palestinian land that is being stolen by the Israeli government and turned over to settler groups. And we we still see like we have for years, Israeli settlers bulldozing Palestinian olive uh olive

[34:10] trees, for example, setting fire to homes and building new settlements. And in the meantime, Benjamin Netanyahu seems to be getting away with this policy of not just allowing Palestinians to leave, but encouraging them to leave and not allowing them back in. >> Where do you think this is going? This is the very definition of ethnic cleansing. uh for sure uh uh I wouldn't be investing uh if I were uh the people attending these seminars uh for multiple

[34:42] reasons. Uh I'll leave aside the moral reasons uh because I know that most of these investors would not be interested in any moral argument that I have to make on it. But uh first of all, the Gaza Strip is Hiroshima. Uh it's actually Hiroshima times five. Uh it is entirely toxic and contaminated land as a result of five Hiroshimas worth of

[35:12] high explosive uh and uh of course the consequent death of hundreds of thousands of people. Many of them unburied uh many of them uh having seeped not to put too fine a point on it into the water table into the soil. It will never be glad confident mourning in the Gaza Strip. Uh even if you buy a condominium built on the skulls of

[35:43] Palestinian children and even if that does not haunt you, and I hope it does, uh you may very well find that it's not the healthiest place to live. Second, the Palestinian resistance hasn't gone away, you know, and uh a Trump Tower or a casino or a bordello or a condominium uh is going to be prime targets forever more for Palestinian resistance groups uh who will be the grandsons of the

[36:13] martyrs who were slain in the uh conflict uh that we saw since October 7. Thirdly, and uh I hesitate almost to make this point because international law seems to have gone out of fashion, but it would be flatly illegal uh to buy uh land from peopledeed who whose property it does not is not uh and of course whose property it is has already

[36:45] just last year been re-emphasized by the highest court in the world, the International Court of Justice, which has again declared, reaffirmed that this is Palestinian land. It is occupied territory under international law. Now, that might mean nothing to Netanyahu. clearly means nothing to Donald Trump, but it might not mean nothing to a judge somewhere who is

[37:16] called upon to adjudicate a land dispute uh between someone that says that condominium's built on my land and I never agreed to sell it. It might be a problem for governments uh including my own uh which have already recognized a Palestinian state based on the borders agreed in the Oslo agreement. Now those borders include the

[37:49] entirety of the Gaza Strip. So how do you buy a piece of land and from whom do you buy it? And there's an additional peonc here. Netanyahu said just the other day that Israel fully intends to take full control of all of the Gaza Strip, but Donald Trump says he already owns it. His board of peace already owns it. Uh

[38:20] now that's a therefore a double land dispute. Netanyahu thinks it belongs to him. Donald Trump thinks it belongs to him. But international law says it belongs to the Palestinian people as part of what has now been illegally occupied territory uh since uh 1967. It's a very very long time, but it doesn't cease to be occupied territory just because the thief has managed to

[38:51] hold on to it for a very long time. Folks, before we move on to our next question, I want to bring you another word from our other sponsor. I want to talk to you about something that's important to me, and that's medical freedom and being able to make your own health care decisions. That's why I'm proud to partner with All Family Pharmacy. They're a US-based licensed compounding pharmacy that works with licensed providers to give people access to medications like Ivormectin and Mabendazol and they ship directly to your door. Let's be honest, when flu

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[39:56] pharmacy.com/j and use my code john10 to get 10% off your order. That's allfamilyfarm pharmacy.com/jjoh and the promo code is jonn10. George, is there any reason at all to be optimistic about any facet of what's happening in the Palestinian territories? Just yesterday, day before yesterday, um, Minister U, uh, Smootrich, the Minister

[40:29] of Finance, who's also the national security minister of the the West Bank or whatever his silly title is, um, said that the that the Israeli government's policy would be to expel all Palestinians, all of them. and they've made no attempt to hide the fact that that's the policy. Uh, but we have Oslo on the books. We have countless United Nations Security Council resolutions and General Assembly declarations.

[41:01] Is there any reason to be optimistic? [snorts] >> Uh, well, I wish I could say yes, but I have to say no. Uh I have been involved in this Palestinian issue for 50 years, 50 years. Uh and uh we're in a worse position now than we were 50 years ago uh on multiple levels. There are some levels on which we're better off. The height of support for the Palestinian

[41:32] cause in Western countries agreed is of course exponentially greater now than it was 50 years ago. But the Arab the Arab side of the equation is uh immeasurably weaker uh than it was 50 years ago. Uh so um on most levels uh we are uh worse off than we were when the Palestinians had a PLO which was the if you like uh holding uh group for all Palestinian

[42:05] resistance factions when the Palestinian cause was situated within the broader uh progressive movement. ment when there were socialist countries that would support it diplomatically and in other ways. Uh the Palestinian under Arafat with the PLO were far stronger than they are now with this

[42:37] 93y old joker. Uh >> I always say 16 years into a four-year term. Uh well, [laughter] when I first knew Mahmud Abbas, he was an old man and that was 40 years ago. He looked and sounded and acted like an old man when I first met him 40 years ago. And he's still

[43:07] acting at least as the Palestinian president. But I I shouldn't be too rude. I'm often uh I'm often chastised for that. Uh but uh I'm trying to make the point that my friend Yaser Arafat was in a much stronger position even though the Palestinians were not on the land. The liberation movement was not present on the land. Uh they had no uh kind of government on the land. But what

[43:38] has been gained uh by having Abu Mazan's government on the land? What has been gained by having his goons uh using their weapons on the Palestinian resistance in the West Bank uh acting as the security force of Netanyahu's Israel? Well, not very much has been gained by that. Uh the only thing that I could say to cheer you up is that the Palestinian cause will never die. Arafat

[44:10] used to say in fact he said it thousand times to me even though every time I chastised him that it was not very politically correct. Arafat used to say we are not the red Indians. We are not going into the museum. uh we we will not be uh an object of people's fascination uh inside a glass case. Uh I used to tell him we don't say red Indians anymore uh uh chairman but uh it the

[44:43] next time he still repeated the offense. Uh but the uh but the point that he was making is true. The Palestinians will never surrender. And I mean never surrender. I mean the grandsons and the greatgrandsons of the people who fell in Gaza over the last couple of years, they will still be fighting for their rights. The I tell you a story. I was on a speaking tour of Canada. I was in the Arctic Circle in

[45:16] Yellow Knife. In the Arctic Circle, it was 47° below. I went out onto the great slave lake where someone had drilled in the ice uh a nice fishing hole for me to try my hand. And as I approached the young woman who was doing the drilling in the Arctic Circle in Yellow Knife, Canada, I saw that she was an Arab. I said to her, "Where are you from?" She said, "I am from Hifa." Now, she wasn't

[45:46] from Hifa. Even her parents had never seen Hifa. Her grandparents had been expelled from Hifa. But that girl and her children and her grandchildren will still be from Hifa. This is a cause that will never die. And so the apartheite state, the settler state, the ideology that stole the land will never have a moment's peace. They will never

[46:16] be able to relax and think that they have gotten away with this gigantic crime and neither will their uh their uh descendants. George, if you don't mind, I want to uh switch over to something that has become an important domestic political issue here in the United States, and that is the the release of at least half of the Jeffrey Epstein files. Uh there are no good guys in this uh in this situation.

[46:47] The Democrats and Republicans are equally guilty of either committing crimes against children or covering up crimes against children or pretending to normalize crimes against children. But one of the one of the areas of fallout that that we're seeing is is really the the implosion of Peter Mandlesson, the the former British ambassador to the United States, former senior Labor Party leader. There's been some coverage in

[47:18] the UK pre press uh highlighting the fact that there are Labor Party backbenchers who are questioning the judgment of Kier Starmer. You knew what kind of person they're saying Mandlesson was. He's a crook. He's always been a crook and now he's a pedophile and a crook. So, the buck has to stop somewhere, as we say here in the United States. Do you think this is the beginning of the end for Kier Starmer as the as the head of the Labor Party? And what kind of broader fallout might this

[47:50] have in British politics? [snorts] >> Well, uh, he he might be gone by the end of the evening. uh but >> didn't even last as long as the head of cabbage. >> Yes. Uh but I'll come back to that. Far be it from me to correct a master as such as yourself. But uh in fact, it was 2,700,000 pages that were released, not the 3 million that they said they were releasing. So there's a missing 300,000

[48:21] there. And it definitely wasn't the six million pages. that they earlier told us existed. So we're missing 3,300,000 pages. And if they are anything like the the 2 million 700,000 then crowned heads and prime ministers and uh and uh oligarchs of all kinds in business in in media uh and in diplomacy, the royal

[48:52] courts of Scandinavia and so on. Uh God knows who will be the next uh casualty. But to deal uh precisely with your question, Kier Starmer was in uh a whole lot of trouble before the Mandelen scandal. Uh his premiership has resulted in a an approval rating amongst the general public of precisely 10.5%. uh another uh 6 of a percent and he's in

[49:24] single figures. There have never been statistics like this in the whole history of polling. He is the most hated prime minister of my lifetime and probably uh since uh democracy if we can call it that was introduced uh in our country. He is reviled uh not just because he is uh uh singularly incompetent but because he lacks even

[49:56] the basics of uh political leadership. I mean as you know I I hated Tony Blair. He expelled me from the Labor Party after 36 years of membership because of my role opposing the Iraq war. Uh, but I would be the first to concede that Tony Blair was pretty good at what he did. He looked and sounded and acted the part of a British prime minister. He had some

[50:26] finesse. He had some felicity or verbal felicity, physical felicity. Starmer is a block of wood and he started off as a block of wood and it's gotten worse and worse and worse. The wood worm is well and truly eating him up from the inside. Then comes along this grotesque error of judgment which he now claims uh

[50:58] he stumbled into. Didn't know uh then what he knows now. And these are all lies. All he had to do was read my social media, and I know that he does, or people do on his behalf. Uh, I've been exposing Peter Manderson's relationship with Jeffrey Epstein for years before uh, Star gave him the Plump Post as ambassador to Washington. So, he really

[51:30] has no excuse. And the British people know he has no excuse. And believe it or not, you know, you wait a long time for a London bus and then two come along at once. Well, only a day later, another pedophile lord uh was unmasked uh by the media who are in full uh fullthroatated pursuit now. Uh a bit too late, but they are. Uh it turns out that

[52:00] man that uh Starmer appointed another guy as a member of the House of Lords. For your American viewers, that means a member of the legislature for life and a and a red and white hermine coat to go with it to look uh grand and medieval uh when you're doing it. uh he appointed him as a peer knowing as he has now acknowledged knowing that this guy was

[52:31] intimately linked to a multiple child sex offender. So, I mean, Starmark had not much to commend him, but he's now on such a run of bad luck that, as I say, he'll be lucky to last the evening. As a former British Prime Minister, Harold McMillan once said, it's not this damn thing. It's not one damn thing, it's one damn thing after another. And that's the

[53:04] grip that uh Kirst is now in. >> And I want to ask you, George, about your own situation. My my good friend u uh Ambassador Craig Murray has had problem after problem after problem just entering and exiting his own country because he has had the unmitigated gall to stand up for Julian Assange for Wikileaks for the Palestinians. Now

[53:35] you're facing the same challenges that he's facing. tell us about what's happening with you and and the and the things that you've had to do to protect yourself. [snorts] >> Well, he's even higher ranking than me. An ambassador is the equivalent of a cabinet uh minister. It's why you [snorts] call them excellency. I still call Craig uh your excellency. Uh in in British uh constitutional terms, an ambassador is the equivalent of a member of the cabinet. And yet that ambassador

[54:09] Craig Murray was arrested under the terrorism legislation and his devices confiscated and told that he was under investigation for terrorism. Now I was a mere humble member of parliament but I was elected seven times. I was a member of parliament across [snorts] five decades from the 1980s, 1987

[54:39] until just over a year ago. uh seven times elected member of parliament if I may say so. One of the better known people in the country uh with a big audience uh the leader of a political party which obtained a quarter of a million votes in just a few constituencies that we contested. Uh I uh as I say uh swore allegiance

[55:11] against my better judgment to her majesty the queen to his majesty uh king Charles as recently as uh as 20uh 24. So uh for me to be arrested at gunpoint by anti-terror police told that I was not under arrest but I was not free to leave that I had no right to silence if I refused to answer any question. I

[55:43] would automatically, imagine that, automatically be guilty of a terrorist offense and would never fly on an airplane again. Try getting on an aircraft with a conviction for terrorism, the policeman said. And unknown to me, my good wife was held for even longer than me in an adjacent room without any uh knowledge on my part that she also had been taken.

[56:15] And uh we were grilled uh on in her case her Palestinian fingernail. She has a fingernail painted in the Palestinian colors on her uh Islam. Uh how faithful to Islam was she? What practice, what uh what uh uh tendency in Islam did she uh support? She's not even a British citizen, by the way. She's an Indonesian national. Had

[56:48] no intention of ever becoming a British citizen. Uh, and I told the police, uh, you have now made it impossible for me to live in this country because my wife will not remain in Britain having been held at gunpoint by cops under the terrorism laws. That's just not something she'll be prepared to do. And so it has uh turned out. I was grilled on 30% of the questions were on China.

[57:18] Why do I have relations with China? What are those relations? What exactly are my attitudes to this or that uh issue between Britain and the People's Republic of China? They grilled me about Chinese spying in the Houses of Parliament, uh about the uh intentions for the Chinese embassy in London. And so I mean 30% of the questions were about China. And what did I find when I

[57:50] was in Shanghai just last week? I found Kier Star Tmer whose police officers they were following me around in Shanghai begging the Chinese leadership for a strategic partnership. Whilst for the policemen in October, China was a danger to Britain's national security. Last week, Kier Starmer and I were both in Shanghai and he also in Beijing

[58:22] meeting the Chinese president begging for some crumbs off the Chinese table. 70% of the questions were about Russia. I'll give you a laugh. Uh at one point the police officer, this is the political police by the way, not just a Bobby off the street, he said to me, "Why do you admire uh the Russian foreign minister Lavough? Why have you said repeatedly that you admire him?" My answer was, "Everybody admires

[58:54] Lavro. Every ambassador in the world regards him as a master of his craft." When did you last meet Lavough? They asked me. Only a couple of months ago, I said. I shared a platform with him. And the cop actually said to me on camera, "What? A railway platform." I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. This is the caliber of the political police sent to grill me, a seven times

[59:26] member of parliament. So after I laughed, I said, "No, a stage, a platform, an event." He thought I meant a railway platform. >> Oh my god, he was serious, George. >> He was totally serious. >> I thought he was just taking a swipe at you. >> Serious. >> These people are not James Bond. >> Oh, this is painful. >> They're Austin Powers >> or Mr. been. And they are have the gall to question me, a figure in the land to

[1:00:00] send a policeman of that caliber with his gun on show throughout to ask me questions about China and Russia. And if I didn't answer them, I'd be automatically guilty of a terrorist offense. So to answer your question, uh John, we have uh declared ourselves uh in exile. You you might say if you were being humorous, I'm the British government in exile uh in China and

[1:00:33] elsewhere. and uh I intend to stay out of Britain until I have an assurance from the British government that no such indignity will happen to me again. I don't think my wife will go back to Britain in any circumstances. Uh but for me to go back, I would need that assurance. I'm certainly not at the age of 71 going to be held at gunpoint by a policeman that thinks meeting Lavough on

[1:01:05] a platform was a chance encounter in a Moscow railway station. I I will add before I let you go, I was stationed at the United Nations when Sergey Lavrov was the Russian ambassador to the United Nations and literally everybody respected him. He's one of the He is one of the most accomplished diplomats anywhere on the planet. I've never met any anybody that didn't have

[1:01:35] respect for Sergey Lavrov. >> Exactly. >> I wish said that. >> Yes, that's what I'll tell them when they stop me next time in London. George, I am proud to call you a friend. George Galloway is a British politician, a broadcaster, a writer, a legendary freedom fighter. >> He has been a member of Parliament uh covering five different constituencies over the course of more than 27 years. Glad to have him. George, thanks so much for joining us.

[1:02:06] >> Welcome. An honor to be on the John Kuryaku show. The >> the honor is mine. Thank you.
