Title: DeProgram (Ted Rall)
Show: DeProgram Show with Ted Rall and Jamarl Thomas
Date: 2026-03-11
URL: https://youtu.be/lhtyX01IUaE
Duration: 58:00

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[00:02] Good morning. It's Wednesday, March 11th. Thank you for tuning in to the program with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou. Good morning, John. Good morning, Ted. Uh so, by the way, my voice was accused of being squeaky by one of the commenters yesterday. And so, I apologize. >> [laughter] >> I was I was doing a covert action video once. The CIA and I almost walked out when um the big boss came in and said that my eyes were too squinty. >> [laughter] >> Is that a racist comment?

[00:33] Yeah, seriously. Why I oughta >> [laughter] >> Well, I mean, I don't know. Maybe my voice is squeaky. I don't know. We'll let the We'll let the people decide. Um so, just as we went on the air, the news is coming out of the Strait of feeding into our main story this morning. Strait of Hormuz is the main is the main focus of the war now. Iran just hit three vessels. We don't know what kind. We don't know who they belong to. >> We do know. Two two bulk tankers and a cargo ship. Do we know who they're flagged to? Not yet, but one was hit

[01:06] in Omani waters and two in Emirati waters. And also, the other big breaking news is the new inflation numbers are out. No big deal. I don't think we're going to see the effect of the war yet cuz the war hadn't begun. This is for the month of February. Inflation for February is which obviously was before the war is a steady at about 2.4%. Not usually a very bad number, but gas prices were already rising. By the way, I checked the markets right before we went on the air, John. Oil price oil futures are bouncing back up

[01:38] early today. And also, looks like it's going to be a down day, not a crash on the stock on the stock exchanges. We'll see. So, the basically, it looks like the insiders in the administration, the smart ones, are calling the Strait of Hormuz their Death Valley, thus the name of today's episode. They're saying it's basically a no-win situation where basically all the ships are either stuck or as Trump suggests they grow some balls and try to run the straight. Why would they do that? Their bosses won't let them. And

[02:11] or the US Navy has to go in there and risk its own assets. It's a no-win situation. The CNN, although this is not a very reliable report, claims that Iran has already begun laying mines in the Strait of Hormuz. Um The US says it's destroyed a bunch about a dozen or more mine layers, but the Iranians still have a lot of ability with small boats and mine layers. So it could feasibly lay hundreds of mines. And commercial and a basically it's an economic war now, John. It's drones are

[02:43] hitting Dubai International Airport, the world's busiest international airport. The joint military command in Iran now says it's going to start targeting banks and financial institutions in the Middle East. We're also going to talk about a domestic story later in the show. BART, which is the iconic mass transit system for San Francisco, looks like it's entered a death spiral. It may actually be forced to close, which is >> How nuts is that? It's nuts. I mean it was >> is Yeah, it's like one of the wealthiest

[03:15] cities Yeah, exactly. One of the wealthiest cities in America. $2 billion a day for war, but we don't have $400 million a year for BART. It's insane. This is nuts. Strait of Hormuz, shall we? Yeah. Okay. Well, so >> say you can't say you're shocked cuz the Iranians have been warning everybody for weeks now stop [ __ ] with us or we're going to close the Strait of Hormuz and just paralyze the global economy.

[03:46] And yet it does look like some people were surprised and they're the planners inside the administration. I mean the New York Times and the Washington Post are reporting today that uh you know, they're kind of surprised that the Iranians are are being so spicy this time. John, if you you you you know, you you've been in the in you know, at the agency. Isn't it like normal to look at your adversary you know, at conflicts from your adversary's point of view? And like from the from the Iranians' point of view, right? I mean, they've already they know

[04:16] that this will keep happening, right? Like especially with the Israelis involved. John, tell me if I'm wrong and then I'll just throw it to you. >> No, no, you're my percent right. In fact, the job of the analyst is to ask what if and then come up with with the analysis. That's your job. Your job is supposed to always always have a paper ready to go. What if Iran closes the Strait of Hormuz? Iran blows up another American embassy? You know, something that that can just be

[04:47] pulled right off the shelf. I mean, it looks to me like so with the Iranians on board, right? We're kind of share they're you know, whenever you have a partner, you always risk making their mistakes that you wouldn't have made yourself. Yeah. The the Israeli approach to Gaza for years has been this horrible term like mowing the lawn, right? Like go in every few years and bomb the crap out of stuff to degrade Hamas and their ability to function properly effectively. I [snorts] think that's kind of what they had in mind for Iran and they did that, you know, already twice

[05:19] um you know, with the assassination of Soleimani uh and now and then last year with the uh 12-day war. And I think they were just thinking, we'll go in every now and then and do this. But the Iranians are like we can't have that. We can't live that way. We're not going to allow that. Um killed our supreme leader. We our domestic domestically our politics won't tolerate it. We're just This is existential for them. Why didn't That's obvious to me. Why would wouldn't it be obvious? >> Clear. Crystal clear, Ted. I don't get it,

[05:51] either. You Well, you know what? I I retract that. I I get it. I'm sure that the analysis is still being done, whether it's at CIA or DIA or the Pentagon or wherever. I think that the White House is just ignoring it. They made a policy decision. It was not based on the analysis or the intelligence. That's usual. And they're just going with their policy decision. And but I mean And so basically what we're reading now is that uh in terms of the economic war, oil prices are you know, they're expecting a bounce, but

[06:22] they think that as long as things start to settle down within a month, uh that basically they'll be okay and they'll be able to ride things through to the midterm elections, which by the way are already not looking good for them. Is that I mean, how I don't know how realistic that is. And also, don't Iranians read newspapers, too? Yeah, exactly. Can't they just be like, "Oh, well, we just have to hold on." To to give you an idea of the of the political situation for Republicans right now, too, we didn't have a chance yesterday to

[06:53] talk about this, but a Republican congressman from California quit the Republican Party yesterday. Mhm. He said he'll he'll continue to caucus with Republicans for the rest of the year, but he is now a registered independent. He is no longer a Republican member of Congress. He blamed redistricting. >> a huge deal. Now, every once in a while a Democrat will do that. They'll switch to the Republicans. It's highly unusual for a Republican to quit the Republican Party.

[07:23] That's true. And what do I mean, do you make that like I mean, he blamed redistricting. Do you think that's right, or do you think it's just like this a guy This guy knows how to read polls? In part, and in part I think that he's thinking, "What is happening at the White House? Why are they not listening to anybody who has to face reelection?" And I'm just seeing that that we just bombed the Armenian corridor. Uh sorry quarter in in Tehran. Why in the world would we do that? Well, the reports have been like um you

[07:54] know of I'm glad you brought that up John cuz the you know the the reports of civilian damage in infrastructure in Tehran are coming in in a scattered way because the internet's down, right? And it's The Iranians I I've been there somewhere in my photos I have like a screenshot of like you know being in Iran when it was like you can't access this website, right? And it's like in in Farsi. So they do that in times like this cuz they don't want to be hacked. They don't want another Stuxnet virus or anything like that. But also they're

[08:24] they're sort of putting the kibosh on the Israeli spies who are there and you know basically but also you know it may have been bombed. Some of the infrastructure may have just been bombed. But it sounds like a lot of the reports even in the New York Times which are not normally very flowery say that the that Tehran is really being very screwed up and that the people are living in a state of total terror. You know I heard yesterday that much of the bombing in Tehran is in residential areas which the Israelis do all the time. All you have

[08:56] to do is look at Beirut and the the southern Beirut suburbs. Um the only purpose to bombing civilian areas is to kill people. That's it. There there's no military reason why you would bomb civilian targets other than to kill as many human beings as possible. And it seems they're going to kill 92 million Iranians, right? So so like they I mean >> can frighten 92 million Iranians. Yeah, but isn't that just basically isn't that kind of a total war approach? Just going to push Iranians closer to the govern to

[09:29] their government you know which by the way wasn't that popular going into all this. >> No, but people rally around their governments even when they're unpopular when they feel attacked as a whole. Look at 9/11 and George W. Bush's 90% approval rating after 9/11. People rally to their leaders. Eight months after Oh, sorry, nine months after Bush v. Gore, you know, I remember the polls showed that like 48% of Americans didn't even think Bush was the legitimate president of the United States in early 2001.

[09:59] That's right. 91% approval just like that. Um and that's you know, and frankly 9/11 was nothing compared to uh you know, the kind of attack that Tehran is is suffering right now, you know, night after night after night, day after day. >> Yeah. With Yeah, with two heavily armed military forces after Why do the Iranians want to kill civilians? I mean, what what's their thinking there? The Iranians or these races? >> sorry, sorry, the Israelis. Yeah, the Israelis I you know, I think that it's

[10:30] God. This is something I'll tell myself in my head I've never vocalized before. I think that the Israelis so hate Muslims that they just want to kill as many as possible. You know, I say all the time, the reason we saw dancing Israelis in the streets of New York after 9/11 is because they knew what this attack on the World Trade Center meant. They meant they knew that it meant that the United States would go to war and would kill as many Muslims as possible. And then over the next 25 years, we killed 2 million

[11:03] Muslims. And so, I think that they do the same thing. I mean, it's if true, it's I don't really I just don't see how that serves Israeli national interests, but >> I agree. I agree. I think it's I think it's counter to Israeli interests. Um let's producer Robbie West has some housekeeping to uh conduct. So, Robbie, take it away. Yep. Uh this will be real quick. I was going to schedule some streams for John over on his Rumble channel yesterday. Things happened. I

[11:34] was not able to do it. I will instead be doubling up today. So you're going to get triple amounts of John Kiriakou if you're following him on his official Rumble channel. Also, the great Ted Rall fitting sitting quite your properly to my far left will get be getting more animated cartoons up on his X account today. So if you enjoy that stuff, keep an eye out and that's all I got. Goodbye. Thank you Robbie for the awesome animations. Robbie, do we have an ad? Uh sure, I can do that for you. Yeah, throw that. Thank you. Um okay, so John, we have a question

[12:06] that came in overnight and this one is for you. It's from a Nasse Gupta. Uh did John ever have correspondence with Christopher Hitchens? Was he aware of his Vanity Fair piece where he experienced waterboarding firsthand to try to see if it really was as cruel and inhumane as it was portrayed? I'd love to know your thought John's thoughts on on Chris as he and John are two people I admire and respect a lot. Thank you for that question. Nobody's ever asked me that before. Um yeah, I was in touch with Christopher Hitchens. He we talked about waterboarding and

[12:38] what it felt like. He thought that I was exaggerating and so he did it and I wasn't exaggerating. It was as bad as I told him it was going to be. Uh I I had great admiration for Chris Hitchens. Brilliant writer, dedicated analyst, deep thinker, um renowned atheist. And I think that his premature death was was bad for journalism. Yeah. I saw his I saw the video. You can

[13:11] it's probably kicking around on YouTube or something. Um it was I heard that he was PTSD'd. He never really got over the fake waterboarding. Crazy. Um I I have to admit I was I was pissed off at Christopher Hitchens because he supported the invasion of Iraq. Yeah, he did. And uh He later said that he felt that he had been duped. I think maybe duped by the bottom of a a whiskey bottle, but that's just me. Um he also made made sure that everybody

[13:41] knew that you know, if moments before his death, he suddenly decided that God was real and you know, he wanted to be baptized or something that it was just the the chemical dump in his brain talking and he didn't really mean it. I hear he didn't do that. Yeah, that's what I heard, too. So well, you know, good on him for that. You know, I hate the last minute my my in-laws who were lifelong not people of faith decided at the last moment to to

[14:12] convert and you know, I was just like, that's kind of cheating, but you know. Yeah. All right, you probably noticed Rumble is growing fast and it's not slowing down. They're building a real alternative to Big Tech that puts creators first and actually protects free speech. And now there's Rumble Premium, an easy way to upgrade your experience. With Premium, you get ad-free viewing across the platform, no pre-rolls, no interruptions, just the content you came for. Plus Premium members unlock exclusive content like bonus videos, behind-the-scenes drops and more from your favorite creators. Right now,

[14:43] Rumble is offering 10 bucks off an annual subscription. Just go to rumble.com/premium and use the promo code studio at checkout. That's rumble.com/premium, promo code studio. No ads, more freedom and content you actually care about. That's the deal. So John, the the administration is basically look it looks like they're looking for an off-ramp and it looks like they kind of like want to be like, well, we're going to declare victory and just and just say we're done. But the Iranians get a vote here,

[15:13] right? I mean if you're the Iranians, don't you just keep going? Absolutely. Like we said what a week ago, Ted? Maybe now it's a little bit more than a week ago. The for the Americans and the Israelis to win, there has to be utter complete regime change and not just regime change, but a a new pro-American and probably pro-Israeli regime needs to be installed. All the Iranians need to do to win is to

[15:44] survive. That's it. And they Oh, by the way, there's report that Khomeini Ayatollah Khomeini Jr. He He He was injured in the attack that killed his father. Ooh. His legs were were hurt, but he's generally okay. >> [snorts] >> Wow, right. Um so, yeah, no, I mean, all the signs I see are of of defiance. By the way, have you seen any of the propaganda videos coming out from Iran? Um I wish you'd run some of them tomorrow.

[16:16] Yeah. Um they're kind of amazing. So, a lot of them are generated by AI. But, uh there's a version of There's one video that is reportedly released by the Revolutionary Guards that has It's basically set to the tune of These boots are meant for walking by Nancy Sinatra. And it shows like Iranian missiles, you know, streaming towards Israel and Netanyahu running. Um there's a weird LEGO video where basically it shows the bombing of the school and like a

[16:46] like a Quds Force or some like dude like really angry and then like the the revenge rains down on Israel. Um it's I mean, the the cyber war is also a really interesting aspect of this. I mean, you know, do you think this is something that like the CIA would have been interested in you well, is interested in now? Yes. Yes, definitely. >> Propaganda. Yeah, propaganda. You know, when I first started at the CIA, I entered on duty EOD'd with um

[17:17] with a guy. He asked me what I was going to work on and I said, "Oh, I'm going to leadership analysis. How about you?" He said, "I'm going to uh propaganda and covert action." I said, "That sounds kind of cool." Totally. And he's Yeah, and he said He said, "Yeah, I mean, there was still a Soviet Union." As you I'm dating myself. There was still a Soviet Union when I got hired, so he was doing uh anti-Soviet propaganda. So, it's not not like not like it's something new. I mean, they've they've had groups at the CIA doing this and not

[17:50] just against the Soviets for decades. So, yeah, definitely it would be part of the what what's called Persia House. I hate that that term. Why is it called that? Oh, they thought it would be cute. Back when I was still there, they they created um uh Russia House, then Iraq House, now Persia House. I don't know. It's silliness. Uh okay. Um okay, so let's uh shall we do some ads? Sounds good. Okay. Uh first one we can

[18:21] dispose of right away. Aaron Barca, John needs a shirt that says pardon me. I have one, actually. We have such a shirt. Yeah, Trent sent it to me. And you can buy one on uh you can buy one on the um right, can't you? I think so. Yeah, here on here on the website. Uh there it is. I'll put it up. deep deprogram.live. I'm pretty sure. If not, if I'm mistaken, cuz I'm on the air, I can't really look at it. Um is it there? Yep. Okay, cool. I'll leave that up

[18:51] there. Uh okay. Uh Nards26, always Does Does John believe his Australian visa was denied for political reasons? Yes. I don't want to believe that. But yes, because I had already been >> [clears throat] >> to Australia. Right? And I just applied for another visa 2 years after my first trip there and they said no, intending immigrant. So, as soon as I said that publicly that

[19:22] I'd been denied, several Australian um immigration attorneys reached out to me and said, "Happy to help. Won't charge you anything." And I said I appreciate it, but my little window that I had to actually go to Australia had closed. But, I I'll get back there sooner or later. Thanks for the two bucks from Hog. I quoted John in my federal lawsuit. Uh Hog's Candyland and >> Hey, great. the program. Uh thanks for the five bucks also from Hog's. Uh there are rules for every Oh, here's the quote. There are rules for everything that no one pays attention to. Nothing

[19:53] works the way it's supposed to. John Kiriakou. Uh Bielaczyc, welcome to the show also on YouTube. Thanks for the 29.99 Australian bucks from uh Zizic. Uh not to not the uh Slovenian philosopher. Ezra, thanks for the five bucks. Super chat ignored yesterday. We are sorry, sorry, sorry. Trying again. We'll do better this We'll do it We'll try to get it right right this time. Belief growing that Iran might false flag Al-Aqsa. Arab states

[20:23] been feckless so far. What would the consequences be? False flag the in what kind of attack? >> I think Do you mean the mosque or >> [snorts] >> Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Okay. So, Iran would do that to make it look like Israel did it? I mean, I hate I hate having to Guys, be you know, more details, please, [laughter] cuz it helps. Cuz we are in real time here. Don't make us guess what you're trying to say. I think that's what they're saying, though. Right. Um I mean, you can see that stuff

[20:57] coming in from hundreds of miles away. Oh, good point. Yeah, that wouldn't happen. It wouldn't be a very good false flag. Yeah, not to mention, I mean, I I think it would be it's just the idea of it would make the Iranians sick, right? They just would like, we can't do we can't do that. Um Yeah, no. >> Nikuprโคจิ, but they just wouldn't I just don't think they would. >> It's such a holy site. I You don't want to destroy your own holy sites, even if you think it might be a successful false flag. Yeah, Nikuprโคจิ, thanks for the

[21:28] five uh bucks. Hello everyone, quick question, out of topic. John, how do you survive without your stomach? I always thought it was essential. Pardon, John. Oh, it's it's harder than I thought it was going to be. Um to tell you the truth, I throw up a lot, which is not good, and the doctor is like, you should have come back here as soon as you started throwing up. I said, I thought it was normal. So, I've had two surgeries to clean out scar tissue, and um but listen, the bottom line is,

[22:00] I would rather be skinny and nauseous than fat and sated. And my diabetes is totally under control now. So, it worked. I just can't enjoy food anymore. Um yeah, I mean, a lot of people have made that trade-off. Um uh Matthew, uh hey, I'm from Brazil and thanks for the 10 uh Brazilian reals. Uh with Congress claiming we we host secret Chinese bases and Trump labeling our criminal groups as terrorists, could Brazil be a target for intervention?

[22:31] We have elections this year. You know, I'm going to say no because for a couple of reasons. Number one, Brazil's an ally. Mm. Number two, it's gigantic. >> It's too big. >> with a lot a lot of people. And um I mean, we can't fight in good weather. >> as the continental United States. >> It is. And and we can't fight on in you know, in good weather on flat land, let

[23:02] alone in the Amazon. >> [laughter] >> Yeah, with with 40-ft with 40-ft anacondas and [ __ ] >> Yeah, and anacondas and panthers and yes, piranhas. Yeah, we're not going to do it. >> No, it's impossible. You know, yeah. Um >> [laughter] >> Super Talfa 1999, thank you so much. John, given your knowledge on Saddam, could you share any info about the Talfa Talfa tribe in Iraq? I'm a Jordanian-American Talfa and I want to

[23:32] learn about where my tribe comes from or where my direction. Wow, that's cool. Well, the Talfa tribe was extremely important in Saddam Hussein's uh time. His father was uh Khairallah Talfa. Uh they were based in well, specifically in the in the village of Al-Awja in uh in Tikrit, northern Iraq not in north-central Iraq. Fierce fighters. Uh proud large tribe.

[24:03] That's That's something Listen, Saddam and his wacky family aside, that is a very proud uh tribe to be to be a part of. Congratulations. You know, I love this kind of thing. I Nobody knew these tribes like I did. And one time I gave a briefing to the Deputy Secretary of Commerce. He wanted this briefing on tribes and I went out there with a with a map of Iran-Iraq. Well, actually it was just like Iraq and the Arabian Peninsula. And I was there for hours just talking about

[24:35] tribes. And before I could even get back to the building, the Deputy Secretary called the Deputy Director of the CIA for intelligence to say that I had given him the most detailed briefing he had ever had in his life. And he said, "Now, that's an expert." I love that stuff cuz I love studying my own family. You know? So, I congratulations on being a member of the Tolfa tribe. That's wonderful. Maria Vagand, thanks for the $3. That's

[25:08] just the three Thank you for the $3. So, then thanks for another generous $19.99 contribution. >> you so much. >> Good morning, gents. The fraud is in Minnesota. It was terrible and Fox News played it over and over, but another podcaster found fraud in Lakewood, New Jersey with the Hasidic Jews doing the same thing. It's been crickets on the other side. >> Oh, I'm I'm shocked. Shocked, I say. >> [laughter] >> The you know, the thing about about the Orthodox Jews as a community

[25:40] is they have this institutionalized policy of cheating welfare. You'll You'll find people with eight, 10, 12 kids. They're all on welfare. And that's why they have so many kids. Because why would they work when they can just study the Torah all day long and make you and you and me pay for their That's what they do in Israel, right? That's how they They do in Israel? Which we said they don't work. They don't They don't join the armed forces.

[26:12] No. Uh although not joining the armed forces when you're an Israeli is a point of honor as far as I'm concerned. >> True. There you go. Keith Fellers, BB is Is BB still couch surfing? I think so. I You know, he was in Germany a week ago. I heard day before yesterday he was in Cyprus. He's been silent. So, he's hiding out somewhere and I don't think it's in Israel. N2100, what happens when the world stops trading in the US dollar?

[26:44] Yeah, the economy goes into a tailspin. In all seriousness, this is something that I think is a is a long-term like a big long term fear of every presidential administration. As soon as countries start start buying and selling oil in a currency other than the dollar on a regular basis, we're in deep trouble. John, how was being Ray wants to know how it's being on Scotty's new show? It was fun. Um

[27:16] It was short. We It was also It wasn't just Scotty Nell Hughes. It was her daughter and it was Ben Swan's son. They're both uh journalism students. And it was kind of a cute premise. It was um It was why did I finally blow up in fame among Gen Z when I'm in my 60s? That's That's a I'm glad someone did that. >> [laughter] >> It was fun. That's worth doing. Um DC, and this brings us to our Maybe we

[27:47] should talk about BART. DC 8828, San Francisco also has the worst homeless crisis per capita in the nation, and that's not new at all. John, let's talk about BART if you're if you're Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I lived I used to commute on BART. Um I lived there for uh in San Franci- I lived in Berkeley, and I used to commute into the city of San Francisco every morning. Um and this was in the uh mid-90s. And BART is an iconic uh mass transit system that dates It was

[28:17] They started in 1972. At the time, there was basically mass transit was a disaster in the United States, and nobody was building new systems at all. Um BART was along with the DC Metro was like the two big systems that were like we're going to start We're going to get serious about mass transit. We're going to do it again, right? The energy crisis really drove it. And And anyway, it spread throughout. And um it's it's So, now basically it's kind of like that I don't I For people who aren't familiar with San Francisco, I

[28:48] kind of want to explain. So in the city you have the Muni system, right? Which is basically street cars >> That's right. and uh that go underground sometimes and that are out on the street at other times. Not to be confused with the classic sort of tourist street cars. And then there's a bus trolley system. Um that's sort of and then uh BART is more like regional transit. So in New York that would be something like LI the Long Island Railroad, the Metro-North. Um it's it's more like the system they have Marta in Atlanta where it goes out

[29:20] into the suburbs or DC DC Metro goes out into [clears throat] the suburbs. Anyway, the point is um it is a a kind of a sketchy system. I mean it's like there's not a lot of security. Doesn't It feels like, you know, people see people smoke crack on the trains and stuff. Um it's also very expensive. Like if you wanted to take uh a BART from SFO to like say the northern San Francisco Bay Area, it could easily be 14, 15 bucks one way. Um and so, you know, as opposed

[29:50] to like here in New York City >> where it's a flat fare, which is an effort to, you know, basically make the system equitable for people who are poor and live out in the sticks. Um you can take the train from the Bronx to Far Rockaway, Queens for, you know, a flat subway fare, which is like, I don't know, three bucks these days. >> Yeah, three I think it's three bucks. Yep. So anyway, I don't I I take it, but I don't know how much it is cuz I'm paying with my phone, right? So anyway, uh it's sort of so I guess here basically what's they're they're uh the

[30:23] BART administrators never recovered from the pandemic. Uh they basically a ridership is less than 50% of what it was in 2020. It's never coming back because of work at home, especially in, you know, a tech city where big tech is. So basically they're going to start um they're they have a $400 million a year annual loss. They're asking for a new sales tax to be approved by the Bay Area residents, but it doesn't look likely to pass cuz they you know they the San

[30:53] Franciscans seem to not really believe the the supervisors of BART. So they're thinking of cutting back the trains, charging more for the fare, parking more for parking, no more trains after 9:00 p.m. instead of 12:00 midnight. A laying off a quarter of all BART workers, closing 15 stations, all of which of course will reduce ridership even more. That's a doom loop, right? It's a doom loop. It's It's sort of like what we've seen

[31:23] in newspaper right? You charge more and more for less and less and you know people leave faster and faster. It's literally possible that by the end of 2027 you might be looking at the shutdown of a major mass transit system do that billions of dollars by the way a lot of federal dollars were invested into. I mean what does this say about the state of the nation? You know we were talking yesterday Ted about defense spending.

[31:54] And and here it is. This is exactly the problem excuse me the problem with spending a trillion dollars a year on defense. When the the mass transit systems of the greatest country in the in the world are circling the drain. Why is it so difficult to get from one side of Los Angeles to the other? Why does it take hours and hours

[32:24] to go from one side of Los Angeles to the other? It shouldn't. And there's a tiny subway system it goes about that far. It's a full of homeless people sleeping on it. Yep. It's gross. It's gross. You can see the potential because it the you know, insofar as it goes, if you ever find it convenient I have taken it and it's like, "Wow, this is really fast. If this went all over, this would be great, you know?" Yeah. But it doesn't. Um yeah, and at least at least they're

[32:55] they're they're building there. Um I So, I mean, what's going to happen here? I mean, do you think it would wake Americans up if like a BART were to shut down or just people who don't live in San Francisco or work in San Francisco just wouldn't care? I think that nobody outside of San Francisco would care because Republicans for so long have used San Francisco as a punching bag that Remember there's even an app that the Republicans put out where where

[33:26] it had a map of San Francisco and it would show you where human feces were on the street. Yeah. Do you remember that? I do remember that. Look, they're not They weren't wrong. I was Last time the cartoonist convention was in in in San Fran, which is only a few years ago, I was on the Muni and some guy pulled his pants down and took a [ __ ] on the bus on a moving bus. I'm a New Yorker, okay? I don't gross out easy. It's like and people were just like, "Woah, whatever." You know, nobody got off. You

[33:58] know, people did barely even moved out of the way to the other side of the car. I said, "This place is degenerate." Um you know, I think people won't care, but it is But it is shameful and uh I don't know. I mean, to me, San Francisco also has a structural problem in in its governance, which is that so much of the tax base is now down the peninsula, uh you know, in Mountain View at like these big companies like Google and Apple. They're not sharing the wealth. Right. So, Palo Alto and Menlo Park and those municipalities get the money. I

[34:29] mean, it'd probably be wise if San There was some kind of tax sharing um thing cuz basically it's very strange. I mean in the old days when you and I were kids people lived in the suburbs and commuted downtown to work. Yes. >> Here in San Francisco the kids the the millennials they live in San Francisco cuz it's fun and cool and Palo Alto is boring and then they commute out to Palo Alto or whatever then they go back and it's it's totally opposite but that means they're paying their you know the the companies they

[35:01] work at are down the peninsula. Yes. It's right. It's backwards. It's very weird. >> And you know and then later urban planning called for called for like nodes to be built. So you build all an office building in the middle of nowhere but then you build housing and shopping around it. New urbanism. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That is I mean I've seen it work in some places. I like San Francisco a lot. I really do.

[35:33] And I could live there if it didn't have these the problem of homelessness and people [ __ ] everywhere and you know stuff like that. It's an amazing city. It is. I really blame the people though. They don't stand up for themselves. They don't. Two quick stories. One time I'm walking down the street and I see someone like throw their litter down on the ground like it's like 5 ft away from a trash can and I'm like hey dude the trash can's right there. Before he can tell me to piss off this other guy who's not even involved shoves me and goes hey man he has his

[36:04] reasons. And I'm like [ __ ] off. What? >> that's sort of like the San Francisco way like if someone's [ __ ] around in traffic like the light turns green they don't go and you give them a little boop a little beep um other people will get mad at you for honking. There's no self policing in the city of San Francisco. It's all the the culture is everybody leave everybody alone everybody's cool and then so you know and I was talking one time on a stuck BART. I was like, "Does this happen all the time?" The guys are, "Yeah, every day." I go, "You guys don't raise hell? You guys don't go

[36:35] out down to the transit authority and scream at them?" No, what can you do? I'm like, "Go down to the transit authority and scream at them. New Yorkers do." I remember moving to New York in 2000 3 and our first night there, my wife and I went for a walk and just at the end of the walk, she stepped in a pile of [ __ ] And she said, "Oh, no, I stepped in dog shit." And I said, "You hope."

[37:06] >> [laughter] >> True. Benjamin Garvin 700 uh uh okay okay, I I am having such a hard time keeping track of all this. Okay. Um Okay, here we go. Um Zizi, thank you very much for the 29.99 Australian dollars. Much appreciated. Um okay. Benjamin, love the show. Iran has over 800 lb of 60% enriched uranium, which is

[37:36] well beyond needed for nuclear power. Is this for negotiation leverage? How did the former Ayatollahs feel about nukes? Thanks. Well, there was a formal fatwa that uh that Ayatollah Khamenei uh had issued what, 20-something years ago, forbidding Iran from developing a nuclear weapon. And two That's never reported in American news. >> Never reported. >> Ever. Two national intelligence estimates concluding that the Iranians did not have a nuclear weapons program

[38:07] and were not seeking nuclear weapons. Nor long-range inter- intercontinental ballistic missiles. The missiles that the Iranians have are barely able to reach like the easternmost Greek islands. That's it. That's as far as they go. Um what Michael, what aspect do you guys think plays a more important role in shaping personality? Race, ethnicity, or religious affiliation?

[38:38] Such an interesting question. I'd have to go with religious affiliation for personality. I think probably, yeah. Um cuz I mean >> all all of them in a way, but yeah, I think I would have to agree with you. Religious [snorts] affiliation. Nate Holden has a question for you, John. Are you still planning to speak at the University of Pittsburgh this week? Pretty sure that you said it would be today, but it looks like you're home. Tomorrow. Um I'm going to I'm going to do it by Zoom.

[39:08] Because >> [laughter] >> Listen, I'm happy to I'm happy to do a speech for 500 bucks for a friend, right? But I signed last week with a Creative Artists Agency, CAA. And they said from now on you speak for 25,000 plus business class expenses. Good for them. >> Everybody else the answer's no. I said, "Yeah, but a buddy of mine at Pitt." And he's like they said, "Okay, do it for your buddy, but it's 25,000 now. It's

[39:40] not 500." And so they've already booked me a bunch of speeches at 25,000. So I told my friend, "Listen, I'm not going to block off an entire day and drive all the way to Pittsburgh for $500. So I'm going to do it on Zoom." Okay. >> [snorts] >> Fair. TS Wolf, thanks for the dollar. Saw yesterday that Hezbollah has sent sent the Radwan fighters into southern Lebanon. Yeah. John, would you mind telling people about the Radwan fighters because I know at least I had no idea how lethal they are. The Radwan fighters

[40:11] were created in 2006. And they are of course a part of Hezbollah's military wing, but they are specifically trained to cross the border and infiltrate um Israeli settlements in northern Israel to kill people. So, you know, Hezbollah is lethal. It's always been lethal. These guys are like extra lethal. They're They're very well trained. They're well armed. They're perfectly happy to do [snorts] suicide

[40:44] uh attacks just so long as they can take out settlers. And now they've been activated. And I was surprised frankly that they hadn't been activated earlier. Donors, um thanks for the $4.99. Uh question for both of us, would you support Jon Stewart for president? No. No. John, you want to say why? No, no, no. Yeah, he's a Zionist and uh he's very DNC mainstream Democrat. I I would compare him very much to Rachel Maddow who to whom I wouldn't give the time of the day. So, no, not

[41:16] interested. >> Agreed with that. Not to mention, um you know, yeah, John never has once had a real leftist when he had his show uh as a as a guest ever ever ever ever. >> Never. Um so, yeah. Ezra PR, thanks for the five bucks. My mistake, I meant Israel doing a false flag on Al Aqsa and then blame Iran. Coffee hadn't hit yet. I think we figured that out. >> Yeah, I know. I can't imagine them blowing up the third holiest site in Islam just to point the finger at the Israelis. Cuz the Israelis are probably planning

[41:48] to blow it up anyway. >> [snorts] >> Oh, the yeah, no, for sure. >> they're talking about constructing the third temple. You got to blow up Al Aqsa to do it. Yep, that's right. Uh Brady Okerlund, thanks for the $19.99. Uh hey guys, if US naval escorts are too escalatory, but I wouldn't say they're escalatory. I just say that they become big fat juicy targets for the Iranians. But leaving Hormuz closed risks recession. What specific alternative would you use to reopen it without rewarding Iran's mining and threats?

[42:20] Good luck with the pardon. I don't think there's anything on God's green earth the US can do about it. I mean, it's it's their neighborhood. They've got they they can button it up tight, you know, like a like a I don't know, something they but they it's there's nothing we can do. No, what what Reagan did was he sent minesweepers and escort ships. And so it was kind of a, you know, face-off. And then it and then it passed. But Ted, you're right. If if

[42:51] they want to shut it down, there's practically nothing that we can do. Yeah, and people might say, "Well, what's the difference?" Right? Well, the difference was in Reagan's time, Iran wasn't looking for a war with the United States. But we're already at war. You know, this is the second time in a year the Iranians think that we're out to destroy them and turn them into a vassal state, which they have good reason to think because that's what the president of the United States is telling them repeatedly every hour on social media. So, like of course, you

[43:21] know, there's it's a different scenario. I mean, the US can the US can try to I mean, I don't even know how many vessels would even accept the escort, right? I mean, just think about the value, you know, which can exceed 500 million dollars worth of oil can be on an oil tanker, right? >> Yes. And so, just think, you know, one thing turns that into a bomb, one little drone. And I mean, you know, if you own that oil, if you're that company, or if

[43:52] you're like Maersk with, you know, some giant shipping contain you know, shipping container ship, you're not you're not going to, you know, you're not going to risk that. Like, "Oh, well, don't worry, Donald Trump's got your back." Oh, yeah, that makes me feel good. You're You're to sit tight until things are okay. Things are not okay. No, things are not okay. Agreed. John Templar wants to know, thanks for the $4.99, is Iran's missile capability showing signs of failure or slowing down? I don't think it is yet, but that's

[44:22] probably coming. I'll tell you, so long as regional countries are are living in fear of these missiles, they're serving their purpose. I'm in touch daily with a friend of mine in Cyprus. She's a kind of a prominent podcaster, and she gives me these daily updates. And Cypriots are panicked. Right? So, there have been three launches. Two two drones, two suicide

[44:52] drones, and a missile. They've all three been intercepted. They were probably headed for the British bases, but Cypriots are terrified. We're going to get to a point where they will have used most or all of their missiles. And then either the Russians and Chinese are going to have to resupply them or they're going to have to just kind of give up, but so far >> the Russians can resupply directly, right? Across the land. >> That's right. Um so, yeah.

[45:24] Uh how would the Chinese do it though? The Chinese would have to go through Central Asia? How would they do Yeah, they'd probably have to go through Central Asia, and I'm not sure that they could get permission to do it. Well, the Turkmen have a Turkmenistan has a official policy of neutrality. Um so, I can't imagine them allowing uh weapons to transit across their country. Um the Uzbeks are corrupt enough that they might let it go. You know, you'd only have to go China to

[45:55] Kazakhstan to Uzbekistan to Iran. You'd only have to get it through I don't know. The Kazakhs would be the hard part, I think, cuz they're they're trying to run a tight ship. Some hilarious breaking news, I mean, uh uh duh, Iran can is said it will not be able to participate in the World Cup due to the current hostilities. >> [gasps] >> Shocking. >> [laughter] >> Uh 20 Mark So, uh thanks for the 1999. Hey guys, love the show. When will it ever be enough for Israel? Do they want to occupy the Middle East? What happens with this 50 to 100 years

[46:26] from now? Oh, it Chad, do you remember the David Bowie ad for MTV? Too much is never enough. Yeah. I do. That's Too much is never enough for the Israelis. >> There's no limit for the Israelis. None. >> If 50 to 100 years from now, I honestly don't have a clue. Uh I mean, care to care to guess? I I it's it's got to be indefinite. I mean, they they won't stop. And they won't they won't listen to reason, and we're

[46:59] not ballsy enough to tell them to stop. So, no, I I I can't imagine anything being enough for the Israelis. Gonzo Lives Matter, thanks for the 999. As As a legal immigrant, I was very sad with your statements yesterday. I followed all the rules because it's the law, and today I'm being seen as the same because of problems caused by illegal immigration. It hurts us all. I I think we we agree with that, right? I'm

[47:29] Yeah. What did What did we say that was? Um I I think basically just sort of the sense that uh immigration you know, takes away American jobs, and you know, we should I mean, look, if you followed the rules, no one you no one has any right to criticize you. None. Zero. Uh Adams, uh thanks for the uh Emirati the 10 Emirati uh dirhams. Any chance that Bibi could taken out by Iran? I think so.

[48:01] You know, it's possible. I'm not if he's hiding in Germany, but it's it's possible. We we saw, you know, in the 12-day war back in October, whenever it was. Um we saw more than a half a dozen drones get through the the Iron Dome. If if Iran is able to flood Israeli airspace with drones, there aren't enough missiles in the Iron Dome to protect

[48:33] everything everywhere all the time to, you know, make a pun. Um so yeah, it's possible. Not likely, but possible. Shahinnajaficity999, John, in your Q&A, you said that your partner is Persian. Love that. What's it like dating a Persian at this time? And what are your three favorite Persian dishes? Don't tell anybody, >> [laughter] >> but I don't really like Persian food.

[49:09] Um in all seriousness, she cries a lot. And it's because like her life every day is is reports of death and destruction. And she she tries to talk to her friends and her family in Iran and around the world, and their stories are stories of death and destruction every day. Um she she usually goes to Iran once or twice a year. She can't do that. Um people are stuck there. People she cares about are stuck there. And you know,

[49:41] there's always a risk of the Israelis bombing an apartment building, which they're doing in her neighborhood. Her her uh, condo that she owns and and where her cousin lives, um, has not been hit, but the neighborhood has been hit. And, um, yeah, there's there's no good that's going to come out of this at all. None. Just death. I mean, let me push back on that a little bit. I mean, could if Iran were to really bloody the Israelis and or the

[50:12] Americans noses to the point where we [ __ ] off for a while and left them alone, wouldn't that be a good outcome? That would be a good outcome, and it would allow the Iranians to reassess and re-evaluate their own policy. Listen, if you are an Iranian leader, and you survive this, you would be a fool to not initiate a nuclear weapons program. You would have to make a nuclear bomb to protect yourself from the next time the

[50:44] Americans and the Israelis decide to bomb you and invade you. Um, at score, uh, John, I was wondering if you Thanks for the 999. I was wondering if you'd seen the video of George Galloway talking about how Israel looks like Gaza now and how the media is lying about the death count of Americans. Uh, hoping you get that pardon. Look, the death count of the Americans is something that clearly the administration is not being straight with us about. The way that the reports are trickling out in like very like

[51:17] unknown like first we get numbers, we don't even know where these incidents happened. Suddenly the numbers spike from six to seven to 140, not deaths, but you know, injuries. Um, you know, I mean, we're clearly not being They're not playing it straight with us. They're not playing it straight with us. And and I will say, too, that I was offended that when Donald Trump met the returning bodies of the servicemen who have died, he never took off his baseball cap.

[51:48] That's his formal baseball cap for formal occasions. >> The Republicans would have lost their [ __ ] if Joe Biden or Barack Obama or Bill Clinton had done something similar. True. >> The Republicans lost their [ __ ] once because Barack Obama wore a brown suit. Did you see what >> Fox? Did you see what Fox News did? Fox News aired old footage from another ceremony where he had a bare head and no hat in it to to illustrate uh to pretend

[52:22] that that's, you know, basically they presented it like here he is at the um at the at the dignified transfer. And it's like and then they got caught out and they had to admit, but of course they admitted on like Fox and Friends at like, you know, 6:00 in the morning on a Saturday when, you know, nobody's watching. Pretty sad. Um um thanks very much for the 100 Saudi Riyals. Uh Thank you. Shia Shia Muslims in Persia don't believe that Al-Aqsa is

[52:52] in Palestine. They think Al-Aqsa is located above in the sky. Yeah, they do. So, a false flag operation is possible on both sides for the Israelis and the Iranians. Mhm. Yeah, that's true, actually. That's a good point. So, okay. Um tw- uh thanks for the 999 from uh 20 Marco uh Marco. I'm asked about 50 to 100 years from now because I'm a young man. All I want is for my children to prosper. How do they do so

[53:24] when officials say they elect um I I I can't can't figure out that word. Uh too misspelled. Sir I don't know. Uh servants or something no beneficial purpose. Honestly, John, I think that like the biggest problem that people are going to have 50 years from now is going to be environmental. Uh it's, you know, the there's already predictions that human civilization is going to start to collapse by the year 2050. I think the environmental situation is what people should be focused on.

[53:55] Ted, may I jump in real quick? Please. One minute. Young Young Courthouse, thank you for the $5. This is so wonderful. Young Courthouse says, "Hey John, congrats on the Sheabutter. Also, John McLaughlin is a professor at my school. Anything cheeky I should say to him? John McLaughlin is the former deputy director of the CIA under George Tenet. And he was one of the godfathers of the torture program. Um yeah. Uh John McLaughlin is an accomplished

[54:25] magician. It's it's a hobby that he's had since his childhood, and he's he's just great at sleight of hand. Maybe you can ask him if he can do some kind of magic trick to make his co-creation of the torture program disappear." Funny. Uh John, we have a few uh questions we really have to get to before we close out. Uh Tangent, thanks for the 20. Uh if Iran did take out Bibi, what do you think the Israeli United States would do? Who is second command after him?

[54:57] Wow, that's a good question. Nobody that anyone knows of. There would be a dozen guys scrapping it out to take over, you know, control of Likud. But he's not a Likud member. And Likud is the is the largest part of the block. Wouldn't they have to have a snap election? I think they probably would have to. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh yeah, I mean, obviously, you know, life goes on. Uh it's not a I don't think it's just a Bibi thing at this point. Uh it's an Israel thing. Um

[55:28] uh also, uh thanks for the buck from Sir Bikes-A-Lot. If you want to interview any new urbanist or transit expert, I recommend Jarrett Walker, author of Human Transit, and Charles Marohn of Strong Towns. Thanks for that. Sir Bike-a-Lot, also thanks for the two bucks. The best transit system that I've ever ridden is the VIA in San Antonio. Second best is UTA in Salt Lake. I like the UTA. If you're not driving your car, then you're not burning gasoline and Chevron isn't making uh SA uh dollars off you. Uh yeah, I mean I'm trying Best

[55:59] transit system in the country. Um I'm going to have to say it's New York City cuz it's the only city in the country that you can truly live a high-quality life and not own a car. >> Not own a car. I would agree with that. Washington's pretty clean, modern, and sophisticated. It doesn't go everywhere everywhere. Um but it goes to Dallas Airport now, which, you know, saves me 75 bucks every time I need to do it. >> Yeah, Dallas Airport is like a good hour drive west of DC. Uh-huh. I mean it's I

[56:31] couldn't believe how far it was the first time I flew in there. Um >> Crazy. Yeah, it's just nuts. Um so, let's see. Um I guess we do have a little time for a few more. Let's see. >> [snorts] >> Uh is Russia Matina now Russia's taking advantage of the war and expanding to the Balkans? I haven't heard that. Yeah, yeah, I hadn't heard that either. Um from an intelligence perspective, John. Oh, I don't know if we have time for this. Uh we have 30 seconds. Um how would the CIA and the Pentagon react if the UK gave US

[57:02] forces 24 hours to leave its bases? If Germany did the same, would Washington see it as a crisis in NATO? Yeah, they would it would never happen, but if it were to happen, yeah, it would be the end of NATO. Sure. Uh someone's taking issue with my idea that John never had real leftists on his show is [ __ ] Really? Name one. Email me. roll.com/contact. Okay. Uh every Thanks everyone for joining us. You've been watching The Program with Ted Rall and John Kiriakou. We'll be back tomorrow, Thursday, March 12th at

[57:34] 9:00 a.m. Eastern Time. Thanks uh please like, follow, and share the show. John, see you tomorrow and everybody else, I'm going to please stick around for the TMI show with myself and Manila Chan except Robbie Manila's out today. Robbie will be filling in. See y'all. >> [music]
