Title: John Kiriakou on CIA Coup Tactics, Trump's WMD, New MI6 Chief
Show: DeProgram Show with Ted Rall and Jamarl Thomas
Date: 2025-12-17
URL: https://youtu.be/2WIKj6XP27w
Duration: 8:00

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[00:00] Thanks for the buck from Fuso. How's the CIA involved in Venez in the Venezuela invasion? >> What would they have you do? >> What they would what would they have had you do if they had sent you? >> There are lots of moving parts when trying to overthrow a government. >> Uh first of all, the CIA is 100% yes involved in whatever it is that our government is doing right now in Venezuela. So what you what you need to do is operationally put pressure on

[00:31] Maduro to to just run away. You want Maduro to run away. But we know that Trump's idea was to make him think that he could run away. >> Yes. And I say that because we now know that the CIA tried to recruit his private pilot >> so that were he to run off like to Havana, >> the guy would actually land the plane in Key West and we grab him and put him on trial for drug trafficking. Allah Manuel

[01:03] Norier, >> which by the way would mean that no other um target of American regime change would ever have caused to believe anything that we promised in the future. >> That's exactly right. Number two, so you well so you have to secure the the presidential palace whether Maduro is in it or not. Um number number two, you have to um either co-opt the military or bombard the military if they can't be co-opted. Uh number three, you have to take

[01:34] control of the television and radio stations, at least the ones in Caracus. >> And these are CIA operations or would these be military operations? It would be it would be joint operations. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Since 9/11, most of of [clears throat] these kinds of operations would be joint with special forces. >> And then third, you have to take over the the main intersections of the capital. But like I've said in the past, like like we talked about on Friday, overthrowing the government is the easy part.

[02:04] >> Yeah. >> Right. >> It's governing. >> It's governing that's the hard part. What do you do the next day? >> Right. That's exactly that's exactly the issue, right? And I mean, I guess you would also need to um now there would be a there would be cyber attacks against Venezuelan internet infrastructure, right? They'd probably cra want to tank the internet, [snorts] >> right? >> And shut down the w the banking wire system so that like regime officials can't send their money overseas. >> Exactly right. Let's talk about this

[02:36] Trump declaration um of street and fentanyl as a WMD. Um so yesterday also at the same time it's worth noting that the US military blew up three more alleged drug boats this time in the Pacific Ocean. Yeah. >> Um according to the Pentagon they killed uh at least eight unknown civilians, unidentified people, supposedly narot traffickers. They're not calling them narot terrorists in this particular press release. Um, so I [snorts] mean,

[03:06] John, the thing that I keep coming back to is and it and and it I don't understand unforced errors, right? So this president uh ran successfully uh in a Republican primary against the Iraq war after the fact and he basically and you know we all know how the Iraq war started out predicated the excuse that was that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. We know that wasn't true >> and it was all a lie and we now know the war was a huge mistake. Well, here we are in Venezuela and again, we're going

[03:40] to use weapons of mass destruction as an excuse. And again, we know it's not true, but we're going to define at least when Bush accused um you know [clears throat] Saddam of still having weapons of mass destruction. At least we knew he was talking about either chemical, biological, or nuclear weapons as defined under international laws, WMDs. Here we're redefining a drug as a weapon of mass destruction, which by definition can't be because a weapon of mass destruction is an individual weapon that goes off and kills lots and lots of

[04:11] people all at once. >> Like no drug can do that. Um so it's like, you know, you can give drugs to lots and lots of people. You could poison the water supply with drugs. That still wouldn't make it a weapon of mass destruction. So >> um but I guess he can do this. And I mean, why I guess the whole thing is if you're trying to overthrow Venezuela, why go about it in the same way that your adversary failed to do the same thing? [clears throat]

[04:42] >> I I I I don't understand it. And not only do I not understand it, I disagree with it because declaring fentinel a weapon of mass destruction so cheapens the process that it it makes the whole process kind of laughable and ineffective. You know, like declaring Antifa

[05:12] a terrorist organization. Did you see this video? I I posted it on Facebook yesterday. It's these two It's these two guys. They're both uh military veterans and they they're filming themselves. They go up to FBI headquarters and they said, "Hi, we're both um Antifa field commanders. We want to turn ourselves in." [laughter] And the FBI agent's like, "Uh, I'm not really sure what to do. Hang here." And they won't they won't take them. They're

[05:43] like, "Well, the president declared it a a um a terrorist group and we're both anti-fascist and so you know I we're both from command." >> Yeah. And the FBI is like, "We we don't know what to do. You should just leave." [laughter] >> Same thing. Fentinel, weapon of mass destruction. >> Come on. And it's like and and we're not even and fentinyl that Venezuela doesn't make fentinel. >> No, it doesn't make

[06:14] >> and whatever they're sending, which is probably cocaine, is not going to the United States anyway. >> No, it's going to to Western Europe. >> Yeah. Um let's talk a bit about this um MI6 lady, Bla1 Metroelli. She's the first um the MI6 is old. They I didn't realize it was 116 years old. um according to uh the press, she's the first woman to run MI6 and she gave a big policy speech and basically she went

[06:44] on and on and on about how the biggest threat to I guess the UK and to Europe in general is Russia and specifically it all comes down to the Russo Ukrainian war. Um I I thought that was some pretty I thought that was really kind of sad. She talked a little bit about uh AI and the uh how it can be used for you know as it'll how it's a threat but also how it can be useful also and you know so she she seems like she comes from the tech side of things but it didn't seem like very did not seem I guess what did

[07:16] you think of her analysis is my question >> not convincing not convincing yes AI is a very big problem but you can't say that Russia is the gravest threat uh to you know freedom and democracy on the face of the earth. Where do you come up with that? Um misuse of technology could be China could be. Russia is practically bankrupt. It has a population that is shrinking to the point where at its current birth rate there will be no

[07:49] Russians in a 100 years. >> Obviously that won't happen but that is a funny factoid. >> [laughter] >> Um well they'll have and whoever's left will have a lot of room. >> A lot of space. >> Yeah. A lot of space. >> But no I this I I'm just not seeing Russia as this, you know, in yourface global immediate threat that has to No, I I just I'm not >> I mean do you think any nation state is even China or is it is it I think that the real threats are going to be more

[08:19] amorphous like climate change which may not be specific nation state versus nation state. >> That's right. >> [music] [music]
