Title: Late Imperial Blues – John Kiriakou (DCC85)
Show: American Exception
Date: 2025-06-08
URL: https://youtu.be/2BBbL8AWrWc
Duration: 25:00

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[00:04] Something beside me. A light to the [Music] kerosene. And the places aren't real anymore. And the faces don't say [Music] anything. In the silent light of the mind blown sphere. It's a

[00:35] game. Devil's chess club. Devil's chess club. [Music] Welcome to Devil's Chess Club. I'm Aaron Good. This is the excerpted first portion of the full episode of Devil's Chess Club. If you want to see more of the interview in today's episode, please

[01:07] consider subscribing to the American Exception podcast on Patreon. We have hundreds of episodes available for subscribers. If you want to better understand subjects like the JFK assassination and the role of organized crime in our political regime, American exception is the best place to go for the deep history of the US empire. The URL is patreon.com/ameanexception. Subscribe if you can and either way, please kindly like this video and subscribe to this American Exception channel.

[01:45] John Keryaku, great to be with you. Hey, great to be with you, Erin. Thanks for having me. Yeah, it's great to have you here again and uh here at the uh at the precipice of doomsday uh it seems uh perhaps. And I guess we can get right into it. What do you make of this latest attack on Russia's strategic air bombers um which were kept in the open not under hangers to be observable as Russia sort

[02:15] of I mean they seem to be essentially trying to adhere to the remnants of the treaties the the former you know the the treaties that people have withdrawn from including Russia but were you know this was still a reasonable measure to take to try to adhere to these things so that both sides know that there's not a first strike coming. You know, you can look at the other side's bombers. What kind what what do you make of the seriousness of this and the the motivations and who who knew what in the

[02:46] US? Yeah. Wow. What an operation, huh? So, I'm I'm of several opinions here. Uh number one, I agree with you. I think that the reason these things weren't hanged was twofold. one because the Russians, for whatever reason, decided to allow them to be observable to American satellites so that the Americans could rest assured that they were not in the process of being used, there is no doomsday, that's that's

[03:18] imminent and even though the the treaty is not really in effect anymore, they're still adhering to it. So I agree with you. Number one, the Russians were trying to do the right thing on that issue. Number two, I think there was a little bit of arrogance involved here where these bombers for the most part were so far away from Ukraine that there was no chance, there was no possibility that the Ukrainians could hit them from Ukraine. And it never occurred to the Russians that the

[03:49] Ukrainians would have instituted this operation to allow them to essentially infiltrate Russia over the last 18 months and preposition drones, smuggle in and pre-position drones to take the bombers out. Third, this was a colossal [ __ ] on the part of the Russians in that the Ukrainians were able to put these suicide drones

[04:19] into shipping containers, smuggle them into Russia over the last 18 months, prepositioned them across Russia as far east as Vlatavastto. It doesn't get any farther east than that. Russia has 11 time zones. This is the 11th and then just patiently wait for the moment when you want to launch this operation. The media are telling us that the Russians lost $2

[04:51] billion worth of bombers in this operation. Two billion dollars. It wiped out their bombers. And the fourth point is I think the Russians probably should have seen something like this coming even if they had missed the fact that these drones were smuggled in because this is what every country that is at war does on the eve of peace talks. You ratchet up the attacks. you ratchet up the violence

[05:22] hoping you can get another meter of territory so that you can negotiate it away at the uh at the peace talks. Like what did the Russians think the Ukrainians were going to do? Just throw up their hands? So yeah, I I was I was asked to give a an interview to a Russian network uh a few days ago and I did. I I generally say to say yes to everybody except the Lindon LaRouche people. And um and they asked me, "Well, was this a criminal act?" And I said,

[05:53] "No, it was first of all, you're at war and so it's not a criminal act to to bomb a military target." Uh but it was a brilliant act of espionage. Brilliant. Some Ukrainian's going to get a medal for this. It was incredible. gutsy and incredible in its result. Do you think it will have the effect that I mean you you're you would put this as a um gambit to attempt to have more

[06:24] leverage to show perhaps the Russ the Russians that we can inflict more pain on you if you don't come to the negotiations. You know, we're not totally just, you know, dead in the water here. But I'm wondering if it's really going to have that effect at all. Because to me, what it really shows is that it it affirms that having a NATO uh outpost on your doorstep is totally unacceptable. And to me, I think it will just strengthen Russian resolve and

[06:56] actually denazify Ukraine. And there and that's exactly what it's done. That's exactly what it's done. I'm sorry to interrupt you. the the Russians released their their demands uh for the for the Turkey peace talks uh yesterday I think it was and it's exactly the same set of demands that they had in the very beginning of the conflict they haven't budged one inch not one iota they they want uh the Donbass Keran Crimea uh

[07:27] permanent uh military neutrality for Ukraine and denazification this is exact exactly what they said they wanted at the very very start of this military campaign. So, you're right, it didn't have the effects that the Ukrainians, I think, wanted it to have. And another thing, too, I think that this attack was just as much a message to Donald Trump saying, "You can bloate all you want about ending this war. we're

[07:58] going to keep fighting and if you're not going to help us, well, we're going to rely on the Europeans and we're just going to keep fighting ourselves. And I think that's where they left it, right? I mean, it's just a strange military conflict. I don't know if there's one like it in history where one side is so overmatched and the the bigger picture terms are all so unfavorable to it, you know, with and so a tactical I I don't even know the analogy here. It's like if

[08:30] I hid behind a cleverly like, you know, put myself under a box, you know, and like walked around with it like in that video game Metal Gear, right? And like I I popped out of the box and I punched Mike Tyson in the testicles, right? And I'm like, "Yes, that was tactically brilliant." And he's going to be like, "Ah, you know, he's he might be hurt for a minute or two, but then where am I now?" Now I've got a very angry person that I cannot hope to defeat, and I've

[09:00] just provoked him in a really terrible way. I mean, I I think that it's a tactical success, but a very dumb one. Strategic failure. You know, it that's a really good analogy, too. And and one of the things that I think did not play in the Ukrainian calculation was that the Russians have access to virtually unlimited ground troops, not Russians and artillery and artillery

[09:31] because they've got the North Koreans, they have the Bella Russians, there are reports of Chinese that have signed up to fight. Um, I read yesterday that the Ukrainians have lost something like 31,000 uh troops in combat. The Russians perhaps double that. But Russia is far larger and more populous than Ukraine is. And they have these North Koreans and Chinese and Bellar Russians and whoever else wants to join the Russian military. So this is not

[10:04] something that the Ukrainians can keep up forever. And you're right. I mean, maybe they maybe they just stirred up a hornets's nest, but I I think that they are hoping that Donald Trump has some sway over Vladimir Putin. I don't think he does, but I think they think they hope he does and they can come out with something that might look halfway honorable uh in Turkey,

[10:34] right? And I am really I'm I'm skeptical of that. It doesn't seem that they can they can do this. And the question is what was the US knowledge of this? because I feel that there's a there's part of the US that would think okay we want to have even though we know that we are messing with Russia's deterrent capability and that this could be perceived as very threatening we want to somehow have a way to inflict pain on them to maybe get a better deal at the

[11:06] end but there if if things don't work there I mean I think that there is potentially a a segment of the western regime, the deep state, you know, the the west western imperialism, US imperialism that is so it cannot accept the US being anything but the global hegeimon. And since they they've lost every way, the only thing that they still have in their bag is a is a nuclear war. And so maybe they're

[11:38] thinking we will weaken Russia's ability to wage nuclear war so that we can win a nuclear war soon. I mean, these people are such lunatics that I I mean, what do you think are the chances that people want this, want a nuclear? Well, I I I think there are people who want that. I think you're exactly right. There is a faction, not just in Ukraine, but here in the United States as well, that believes a nuclear war is a winnable war. that sure millions of people are going to be wiped out, but like Pat

[12:08] Buchanan said in 19 whatever it was, 1992 when he was running for president, um, of course a nuclear war is winnable. We come out from from our caves and we pick up and continue the fight. And so I think that there is a faction I know it's crazy, right? I know that there is a faction in Ukraine that believes that a nuclear war is winnable or that even if the the Russians were to resort to nuclear

[12:39] war, the Americans, the British, and the French, also nuclear powers, will step up against the Russians and perhaps use nukes as well. And that's insanity, of course, but I think that that's probably a Ukrainian calculation. that what what what would be the lesser of two evils? To just let the Russians roll into Europe, as people say, roll into Europe, or or to use nuclear weapons to preserve freedom and

[13:10] democracy. As far as rolling into Europe goes, why you understand why Germany would want the lean ramen? They were very explicit about it. They needed Russian resources to fuel a German industrial base and a German war machine. There was a logic behind exterminating the Slavs and taking it for Leven's realm. An insane evil Nazi logic, but a logic. Mhm. What What is Reab have that Russia would need

[13:41] to, you know, that would that would make them invade Germany, for example? I mean, honestly, I think the Europeans need the Russians a lot more than the Russians need the Europeans. When I was in the UK just a few weeks ago, I was giving a speech in Nottingham in in the Royal Albert Hall, gorgeous historic uh place, big round uh event center. It was so freezing cold in there that literally everybody was complaining. And finally, the manager

[14:12] told us, "We're just not getting Russian gas and we can't afford to heat the place. That's it." And that's that's most of the most of the homes in the UK and Germany and Greece. I was in Greece this winter and it was freezing everywhere you went because they're not getting Russian gas anymore and it's just too expensive to buy it from, you know, the United States or or elsewhere. So yeah, I I've come to the conclusion that that the Russians don't need Europe anywhere near how Europe needs Russia.

[14:46] Ditto for China with the rare earth metals. Uh oh yeah, this whole I don't know why they sell us rare earth medals. No, I don't either. I don't understand why they do a number of things that they do. They still send students to American universities um which and and high schools, you know, private schools and so on. I'm wondering how long that will be the case. And I the US is really shooting itself in the foot by not relying on its status as a place where people even in adversarial

[15:18] countries like China they still think that we have something to offer in terms of education. And I think that there are good educational traditions in and institutions in the US if you have money especially uh but and that they are working on building their own but we're in this is just another area where we're forcing them to build their own. It's sort of like a different version of import substitute industrialization except it's with like education and sending your kids overseas but they don't need to do that. They could hire, in fact, they

[15:49] could probably hire a lot of Americans, and they probably are, to teach in Americanstyle schools. I do understand that that's happening over in China. And a lot of Americans would be happy to get out of this country, which whose fascism is now bubbling to the surface. It's not even hidden anymore. And think of it this way, too. If I were the CIA director, I would want as many Chinese PhD students in American universities as possible because every single one of

[16:19] those Chinese PhD students should be a CIA target for recruitment. They're they're almost exclusively in the hard sciences, right? And they're going to go back to China and they're going to take positions of authority. they're going to rise up through the ranks of, you know, the Ministry of Defense or whatever. I would want to recruit them while they're in college in the United States and then send them back to China and and have them work in place. Number

[16:51] one. Number two, you're exactly right that the Chinese don't need us anywhere near the way we need the Chinese. I'm not talking about the US buying their trinkets and their cheap junk that they make and and send to the United States. It's better these days though. Their stuff is better. It's like it's like Japan. Japan was known the same way. They were the Japan was the producer of cheap junk until suddenly by by becoming good at that. They're actually I mean they're going to make they're working on semiconductors and such now. Yeah, they

[17:22] are. That that is true. I'm thinking of the bolt cutter that I bought at Home Depot. Oh, yeah. that when I went to cut a a Yale lock, the bolt cutter just like exploded into five different pieces. Anyway, um I I went to Hong Kong last year for a conference. And I was struck at how few places took Mastercard and Visa, but they took this thing called the Panda Card. And finally, I asked, "What is this Panda card?" And they said, "Oh, it's our national credit card. It's like it's like Visa and

[17:53] Mastercard." I said, "Why don't you just use Visa Mastercard?" Oh, that's smarter to use that. Yeah. Oh, much smarter because they said Visa and Mastercard, every transaction goes through New York. Panda card, every transaction goes through Shanghai. And so then we're not subject to American sanctions. You know what? I bet it's I bet it's I bet it's nationalized, too. Oh, it is. I'm sure it is. That's what I'm saying. We It's brilliant. Yeah. No, we are idiots for using Ma It's not just that they shouldn't use Visa and Mastercard. We

[18:26] should have some sort of nationalized system because there's a couple bucks on every transaction and it just goes to the stockholders of Visa and Mastercard. It's just it's rent seeking. It's the same with it's the same everywhere. That's a great point. It's why we're going to lose to China because our economy is so overpriced because we have all these toll booths up and all these little mafia rackets that are like, "Oh, you want you want to pay for gas? We got to get a little taste. Like everything is about you're getting screwed every

[18:57] way. That's all the capitalism has become is a series of rackets and we're not going to be able to compete with them. They're going to have a better society, better technology, happier people and we're just stuck here as neofudal, you know, rent peeons. That's right. You're absolutely right. And why is it that we see it and the people in the White House and the Department of the Treasury, regardless of who happens to be president at any given time? Why don't they see it? Because of the who pays their campaigns. It's not they

[19:28] don't get they don't campaign on the basis of the public interest. They campaign on pleasing people with money. And the people that have money are the people that own rackets that allow them to just make money in their sleep and bribe politicians. And that's right. That's and that really is the West. But you know this this issue of uh how this is going to to change and how it is changing uh is going to be the defining issue of our time unless it's nuclear war which I I hope isn't the case but do you think that this settlement they're

[19:59] having these talks let's getting back to Russia here for a second they're having these talks in Istanbul I think most people are thinking they will not be fruitful uh right and then potentially I don't know if they when exactly they are going to end if they have ended uh is right now. I mean, I'm not even I I should have checked this morning. I'm more up to I checked this morning and and they were still ongoing when you and I started recording this, they were ongoing. Yeah. But after this ends, I it seems that we may be nearing the the getting closer to the collapse of the

[20:30] Ukrainian military. Everything that you see about them impressing people off the streets, you know, with these gangs going around trying to get like these hless people, you know, they're not getting any good sort of training. They're probably being, you know, I don't know if it's to the state of like the Russians at Stalingrad where they give the rifles to the people in front and they expect them to die. So then you pick up the the dead guy's rifle, but like it looks really bad for Ukraine. What sort of settlement do you think that we would end up seeing here? Do you think that Russia would essentially cut take all the Black Sea, Odessa, you

[21:02] know, all the areas that are, you know, I I don't think so. I think that in the end the Russians are going to get everything that they're demanding. They're going to get the Donbass. They're going to get Crimea. They're going to have to be recognized, at least de facto. Uh they're going to get an assurance that Ukraine will never be a member of NATO. And the only concession I could see them making is that they

[21:33] would they would acquies to Ukrainian membership in the European Union, which they've already said. They weren't opposing anyway. No, they weren't they were never opposing that. Um it's it it makes it better for Russia. Yeah. So I I think it's bad for the EU. The EU would have Yeah. It's not good for the EU. It's an economic basket case. It's one of the most corrupt countries in the world and they're going to have to subsidize it probably for the next two decades. Wouldn't they be obligated to take refuge you mean

[22:03] migrants and such? Oh yes, without any doubt. Yes. I'll tell you I go to I go to um Iceland a lot on business. I go every month or so and um I've seen more Ukrainians in Iceland than any other nationality. almost as many Ukrainians as Icelanders that I've dealt with. They work in every hotel. They work in every restaurant and bar. They work as cab drivers. The place is absolutely full of Ukrainians. And none

[22:34] of them have any plans to go back. They like it just the way things are. Well, John, I know that you have to go uh because you have another interview. So, um I just wanted to thank you again for being here. Where can people follow your work? Oh, thank you. Oh, thanks, Erin. Um, there are a couple of things, more than a couple. I've got uh two podcasts. One is called Deep Focus with John Kuryaku. That's on YouTube. I have a podcast with Ted RAW called Deeprogram. That's also on YouTube. I've got a TV show on an online platform called

[23:05] Unified TV, NU FYD. That show is called CIA Declassified, where we take declassified documents and tell the historic, you know, background stories. And um and I'm on Substack. Everything I write, everything I I appear in like this show here goes right on Substack. johnyaku.substack.com. And thank you so much for having me. Yeah, very good. And until next time, John. Thanks a lot. Thank you.

[23:40] Thanks to Dana Chavaria for producing this episode and thank you for tuning in. Please do consider subscribing to the American Exception podcast on Patreon. The URL is patreon.com/ameanexception. We need subscribers because we will never be viable on this platform. Isn't it strange that the majority of alternative media people who focus on the clandestine crimes of the imperial capitalist US regime? Isn't it strange that the majority of these people are political rightists? Shouldn't it be the

[24:12] left that says, "Yeah, these greedy criminals will do anything for money and power." Somehow many on the left think it is a mark of sophistication to deny state crimes like the assassinations of JFK, RFK, Martin Luther King, and Malcolm X. I have to believe that a lot of algorithmic juice and social engineering has gone into keeping the left studiously ignorant about the institutionalized criminality of our system of governance. We need to fight against this. So again, please do

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